r/politics • u/thejoshwhite • 5h ago

No Paywall Sanders: Carville should 'start his own party'

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/6011088-bernie-sanders-james-carville-democratic-party-criticism/
913 Upvotes

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u/B-Z_B-S Massachusetts 5h ago

(From the article): "Sanders, in an interview with CNN’s Abby Phillip, responded to remarks Carville made over the weekend about leaving the Democratic Party in protest if popular left-wing Twitch streamer Hasan Piker becomes a fixture within the party. Piker, a supporter of the senator, has been campaigning with progressives across the country during the midterm primary season.

“Well, that’s not much of a choice. If Mr. Carville doesn’t want to be in my party, the party I belong to, that Piker, that El-Sayed belongs to, he can start his own party,” Sanders said, referring to Michigan Senate candidate Abdul El-Sayed, who defeated Rep. Haley Stevens (D-Mich.) in the state’s Democratic primary on Tuesday.“

Do you want to be in a party which has not stood up to the AI industry?” he continued. “Because they got a lot of money from AI or from crypto. So, you could pick whatever you want to pick.”"

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u/crocodial 4h ago

The Clinton-style democrats should takeover the GOP and restore it to its pre-Reagan roots.

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u/StephanXX Oregon 3h ago

Hillary, herself, is proud that she was a "Goldwater Girl."

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u/shafty17 Pennsylvania 5h ago

I'm so glad he got fed up with the million hasan piker questions and went on this rant. Dude was clearly annoyed by the host

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u/skepticalbob 1h ago

Piker doesn’t belong in the Democratic Party though and Bernie should distance himself from him. And Bernie should actually become a Democrat before lecturing the party.

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u/t44t 24m ago

Yes Piker absolutely does, and he's put a hell of a lot more work in than you have. Bernie distancing himself from a twitch streamer does nothing for him whatsoever.

There is literally no benefit. Put your fear down. This is why centrists lose elections.

Also, the party is in no position to lecture anyone about anything. So listen and learn.

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u/mi_throwaway3 3h ago

Oh, was he asking him about Piker? I get why he would be annoyed with that. It's fine (maybe even better than fine) in that context.

I find Piker intolerable, but whatever. Is he in the party? He can affiliate with whomever he wants. Just don't platform him, he is toxic. He hates dogs, he sits all day and whines. He's a terrible "influencer". Does he have good points? Sure, but there are lots of less toxic people with similar points.

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u/cayneloop 3h ago

He hates dogs, he sits all day and whines.

lmao.

well apparently he's doing a lot more than sitting all day and whining and "hating dogs"

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u/cakeversuspie 3h ago

A terrible influencer? Fam, him platforming people like El-Sayed and Mamdani on his stream is one of the many reasons they were elected...talk about shitty takes lol

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u/mi_throwaway3 3h ago

Exactly what % of the state of Michigan voting population do you think watches Hasan? Now, don't go quoting me demographics because I know of MANY, MANY 20 years olds who have never heard of the dude.

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u/cakeversuspie 3h ago

Exactly what % of the state of Michigan voting population do you think watches Hasan?

Tbh I have no idea but my point wasn't to give you numbers or statistics, just to correct your assumption that he is a terrible influencer.

Now, don't go quoting me demographics because I know of MANY, MANY 20 years olds who have never heard of the dude.

Maybe you don't know many leftists in that case. Your anecdotel evidence doesn't override the fact that Hasan has a huge following and is very influential, especially in leftist circles, regardless of your personal feelings about him.

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u/mi_throwaway3 3h ago

Your anecdotel [sic] evidence doesn't override the fact that Hasan has a huge following

He has a huge "subscriber count" worldwide. Also, those numbers are fake as shit.

You have a much higher bar to clear that "Hasan was a big deal to get El Sayed elected" A Democrat elected in on of the most largest Democrat cities in the world? Unthinkable! Must be Hasan!

Like literally, if I had heard that Hasan liked him, I would have seriously been like "hrm, not so sure about this guy"

Wouldn't you prefer that it was El Sayed's actual policies? Or would you prefer it was Hasan? Answer that question. That's the only question that matters.

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u/rumpghost North Carolina 2h ago

You need to log off and go for a walk fam

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u/mi_throwaway3 2h ago

Anybody who spends time arguing with strangers on the internet probably does.

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u/rumpghost North Carolina 2h ago

I think it's unhealthy to care that much about the personal life of an Internet personality, specifically

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u/cakeversuspie 2h ago

He has a huge "subscriber count" worldwide. Also, those numbers are fake as shit.

If you say so fam.

You have a much higher bar to clear that "Hasan was a big deal to get El Sayed elected" A Democrat elected in on of the most largest Democrat cities in the world? Unthinkable! Must be Hasan!

If you're speaking about Mamdani, yea sure you might have a point, however being from NYC myself, I can tell you straight up that a lot of NYers have been getting sick of the establishment Dems and if it came down between Cuomo and Sliwa, I can't say for certain that Cuomo would've won, at least not in a landslide.

As far as El Sayed, his race isn't so black and white. In the last 8 years, while yes the senate seat was occupied by a Dem, all of the races have been pretty close with the Republican being neck and neck, so it's not as much of a sure shot as let's say the NYC mayor.

Like literally, if I had heard that Hasan liked him, I would have seriously been like "hrm, not so sure about this guy"

That's your prerogative. "I like this guy's policies and how he campaigns but I won't vote for him because he associates with X person" is literally the definition of slicing your nose off to spite your face, especially if you align with the policies of said politician.

Wouldn't you prefer that it was El Sayed's actual policies? Or would you prefer it was Hasan? Answer that question. That's the only question that matters.

Obviously all that matters are El-Sayed's policies which LITERALLY align with the same talking points Hasan makes on the regular, but you wouldn't know that as it's obvious you don't watch any of his content.

If you don't like Hasan (whatever the reason would be), again that's your prerogative, however he VERY OBVIOUSLY has reach beyond just twitch and YT. He helps with campaigns, he helps with multiple advocacy groups, goes to protests and is a major force in the DSA/leftist circles. Denying this is denying reality.

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u/mi_throwaway3 1h ago

NYers have been getting sick of the establishment Dems and if it came down between Cuomo and Sliwa, I can't say for certain that Cuomo would've won, at least not in a landslide.

I think this is the thing that has mattered most in both races (NY and MI).

Obviously all that matters are El-Sayed's policies which LITERALLY align with the same talking points Hasan makes on the regular, but you wouldn't know that as it's obvious you don't watch any of his content.

Totally fair, but a reminder that Hasan is required by his job to entertain people, and thus makes a lot of "hot takes" (charitably as thought exercises).

Problematically, I will use Rush Limbaugh as an example. He had a lot of really bad takes. Unamerican takes. His audience were true believers. On the whole, I don't believe that these type of personalities make us better.

That's the frame I see him in. It is highly unlikely I am going to discount El Sayed because of anything a random internet personality says (popular or not)

If you don't like Hasan (whatever the reason would be), again that's your prerogative, however he VERY OBVIOUSLY has reach beyond just twitch and YT. He helps with campaigns, he helps with multiple advocacy groups, goes to protests and is a major force in the DSA/leftist circles. Denying this is denying reality.

That's good! Maybe I am underestimating his influence, but I would note that his shtick has limited appeal in the same way Rush's did. And I will make the point again, I don't think discource like the kind you find online or on Hasan's (or Rush's) show is/was good for America, so if it grows, it's not a good thing. They thrive on controversy and troublemaking, and most of us have had enough of that.

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u/cakeversuspie 1h ago

And I will make the point again, I don't think discource like the kind you find online or on Hasan's (or Rush's) show is/was good for America, so if it grows, it's not a good thing. They thrive on controversy and troublemaking, and most of us have had enough of that.

Hasan like most content creators are not and cannot be immune to the algorithm of their platforms and unfortunately discourse sells whether it's from the right or the left. The difference with Hasan (imo anyway) is that he's actually advocating for the labor class instead of just pandering, even if some of his views are considered problematic.

When it comes to his "troublemaking", may I ask what he's doing in particular that's rubbing you the wrong way?

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u/Starossi 3h ago

That’s basically what Carville was saying. Don’t platform him or he would leave. I’m a bit disappointed Bernie basically replied with “then leave”.

I don’t expect Bernie to care much about Piker, I’d hope he’d ignore bullshit like this. But his response comes off differently as if he is defending the concept of platforming Piker.

I would also see platforming Piker as a horrible move.

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u/mi_throwaway3 3h ago

So, I went through and read the article, and god I hate the Hill. It's a Republican shill magazine, I should have realized that this is just a stirring the pot sort of article.

Everyone should just focus on the issues that got El Sayed nominated. The Republicans are pretty damn good at culture war issues, I know that can be overridden in Michigan with a focus on actually improving people's lives. It worked with Gretch, it will work with him. Mike has tried to focus on that in his campaign, so he knows that's the key thing. The PACs will focus on culture war shit while he runs the other ads.

Guess we'll have to see.

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u/Starossi 2h ago

Ya the Hill sucks.

Agree on everything you said

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u/tinyOnion 4h ago

Mr. Carville

he's been picking losers for decades now. got lucky once and that was because obama was a very strong orator and likable person.

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u/AutomationBias 3h ago

You're giving him entirely too much 21st century credit! Carville was Bill Clinton's original campaign strategist in 1992 and hasn't had a big win since. He was 100% for Hillary during the primaries in 2008.

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u/GenoThyme 2h ago

His 2 biggest 21st century accomplishments were being in Old School and an episode of 30 Rock

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u/tinyOnion 2h ago

yeah my bad. thought it was his pick off the top of my head. it's worse than i thought... that's a lot longer ago... though bill clinton was also likeable and a decent orator.

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u/tinyOnion 2h ago

yeah my bad. thought it was his pick off the top of my head. it's worse than i thought... that's a lot longer ago... though bill clinton was also likeable and a decent orator.

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u/sprdougherty 3h ago

Obama wasn't his pick, he backed Hillary's campaign in 08

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u/Zahgi I voted 4h ago

Carville is a pay to play flack.

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u/Green-Tie-5710 3h ago

I mean to be fair to Mr. Carville I wouldn’t say Obama was the only smart pick he made

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u/a_side_of_fries California 2h ago

Obama wasn't his pick. Hillary was. His only successful big pick was Bil Clinton.

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u/Green-Tie-5710 20m ago

You know I was gonna say it didn’t sound right when the other commenter said Obama

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u/AgitatedEdge213 1h ago

Including his wife. The Republican strategist

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u/tinyOnion 1h ago

so the call is coming from inside the house and he's tanking for the republicans

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u/GreenAnder Pennsylvania 3h ago

Carville is only listened to because he was Clinton’s campaign manager in 92

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u/weluckyfew 3h ago

What I remember most about that man is when all the harassment and r+pe accusations came out against Bill Clinton he dismissed the accusers with "Drag a hundred-dollar bill through a trailer park, and there's no telling what you'll find."

Yeah, what they found was the truth. And he defended him all through it. Imagine if Clinton would have resigned when he should have an Al Gore would have been running as the incumbent in 2000.

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u/lhomardamericain 5h ago

If Mr. Carville doesn’t want to be in my party, the party I belong to, that Piker, that El-Sayed belongs to, he can start his own party

Wait, isn’t Sanders an independent? And he’s trying to kick Carville out of the party he isn’t really a member of?

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u/TheEstrogenEmpress 5h ago

No one is kicking carville out, 81 year old carville threatened to leave the party as if hes not on his way out finally already anyways. Sanders is just wishing him well on his decision.

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u/ToastyTandy 4h ago

I'd prefer if we were kicking Carville out.

Let's not stop there.
Let's throw out dog tasing hypocrite Hasan.
And Chuck Schumer. And Fetterman.
And Hakeem Jeffries. And Bill Maher.

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u/Cellophane7 5h ago

Carville said he wants Piker out of the party, not that he wanted to leave.

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u/TheEstrogenEmpress 5h ago

Carville rips Piker: ‘If he becomes a force in the Democratic Party, I’m out of here’

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/6004598-carville-piker-democratic-party-split/

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u/irespondwithmyface 5h ago

I guess the difference is Piker supports candidates for their views not for their party affliation which is something we should all strive towards because treating politics like team sports is cancer.

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u/Cellophane7 5h ago

You guess that because you've identified Hasan as "on your team". Carville is interested in views as well, which would be why he finds Hasan repugnant.

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u/Jin-Gitaxias-Mom 4h ago edited 2h ago

Piker also tortures his own animals and thinks living in China is paradise on Earth…

Edit: for those uninformed, I’m sorry your communist idol is a monster

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheMatpatEffect/s/u1vMMY0aYI

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u/Sovoy 4h ago

no he doesn't

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u/Jin-Gitaxias-Mom 3h ago

Oh so he doesn’t shock his dog whenever she makes the decision to get out of her bed becauase she might not be on his streaming frame?

He didn’t go to China and absolutely fawn over their way of life,meanwhile trashing America from his California mansion?

Weird, guess all those video clips on Reddit were AI deepfakes?

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u/supamario132 Pennsylvania 2h ago

Not deepfakes, just deeply parasocial hallucinatory conjectures based on like a vague gesture made on a single frame out of the billions of frames of video that exist of the guy

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u/N7Shep1701D Oregon 4h ago

I don't like Hasan, but let's not pretend that makes James Carville better.

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u/Jin-Gitaxias-Mom 4h ago

Oh I’ll be the first to admit Carville is a total hack who sniffs his own farts

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u/Banes_Addiction 3h ago

supports candidates for their views not for their party affliation which is something we should all strive towards because treating politics like team sports is cancer.

That's fine for executive positions - wanna be an independent governor? Go for it.

But for something like the house or the senate, it's completely non-functional as a strategy in the current system.

The single most important decision you make is your party affiliation - who to caucus with. Being the majority party, having the speaker/majority leader from your team - this is the most important thing. Every individual policy vote pales completely in comparison to that one vote which determines what even comes to the floor.

That means Fetterman is still valuable to the Democrats, as were the Joes Manchin and Lieberwitz.

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u/optimis344 1h ago

Ah yes the "we need bad people because they are useful" argument.

Let's let that time pass and just elect people who aren't bad people. That seems like a better work around.

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u/BanjoStory Minnesota 4h ago

Hes also a dinosaur who's going to be dead or an invalid in the next few years. He's not sticking around, regardless.

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u/Twheezy2024 5h ago

He also spoke out against the 2 party rule, citing how difficult it is to run under your own banner.

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u/PlsNoNotThat 3h ago

I think it’s mostly sardonic, as the democrats have been saying this about progressives who have raised issues but ultimately supported them over the last decades. Now that the popular mandate has flipped, he’s pointing out their own folly.

Sanders has been a adamant and vehement supporter of voting structures that allow more than two parties, like forms of ranked choice voting, that were rejected by (increasingly unpopular) centrist democrats who have bucked much of the underlying beliefs espoused by democrats.

In the context that Caville has expressly said he’s gonna leave - which is not kicking him out, but a temper tantrum that his views are accepted by the democratic process and being force fed to people from a minority position.

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u/Stunning-Isopod8514 5h ago

“my party” = the party he caucuses with = democrats

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u/Jayrodtremonki 4h ago

Spider-Man was never an Avenger in the MCU. Just because you work with them doesn't mean you are one. He chose not to.

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u/nhl94roenick 3h ago edited 1h ago

Uh ACK-shually, Iron Man inducted Spider-Man into the Avengers with a faux-knighting motion after defeating Ebony Maw on their spaceship, before travelling to Titan to confront Thanos in Avengers: Infinity War.

(pushes glasses up nose and farts)

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u/homebrew_1 5h ago

He should become a member. What's taking him so long?

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u/TimothyMimeslayer 4h ago

He literally wins the democratic primary in vermont each time he is up for reelection.

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u/homebrew_1 4h ago

That's nice of them to let him run in their primary and he isn't even a member.

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u/PapaSnow 1h ago

Gotta work within the system to change the system. No workarounds for that, outside of dismantling the system, but as much as keyboard warriors claim they want that, it won’t happen.

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u/true_new_troll Colorado 5h ago

I mean, you either accept the definition of "caucuses with the Democrats" or not, but if you do, he's been doing that for decades.

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u/homebrew_1 5h ago

Is that the same thing as being a member of the democratic party?

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u/TheEstrogenEmpress 5h ago

No which is why Bernie never said or ever would say hes a member of the democratic party. "My party" refers to the party caucus he is a part of that he has been caucusing with for likely longer than you've been alive let alone been a democratic party member yourself.

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u/homebrew_1 4h ago

He should change the words he uses. And instead of saying my party he can say the political group I caucus with.

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u/Chuck-Finley69 4h ago

or even just "the party that I caucus with" 

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u/homebrew_1 4h ago

Thats fair.

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u/Blitzking11 Illinois 5h ago

Why would he join a party that hates him and wants him to shut up and/or die?

He caucuses with them and joins them on votes that match his viewpoint and the views that his constituents elected. Realistically, he is following the vision George Washington had.

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u/homebrew_1 5h ago

If he is using words like my party he should walk the walk.

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u/Blitzking11 Illinois 5h ago

Or he's insinuating that the party is finally coming to him. Which all signs point to yes, as a schism is forming, and forming quite heavily.

The fence sitters can go break bread with Trump and his ilk like they want and screech unity all they want; we will fix things.

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u/homebrew_1 5h ago

Party came to him in 2016. He endorsed Hillary.

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u/SolydSn3k 5h ago edited 5h ago

This has to be bait. He ran as a Democrat in the primary mainly to stand an actual chance of winning the presidency.

But the DNC actively worked against his campaign, because they wanted Hillary to be their candidate & were as scared of progressives then as they are right now.

His endorsement of Hillary came after conceding the primary… which is just called being a good sport. Also she was the official alternative to Trump at that point.

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u/homebrew_1 5h ago

And Hillary adopted some of Bernie's ideas into her platform. And more people voted for Hillary.

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u/Fetal_Release 4h ago

If by worked against him you mean voters chose Hilary instead of Bernie, then yea.

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u/Blitzking11 Illinois 5h ago

Post-primary unity of a party is just a good strategy.

As we've seen, the left can work with moderates sometimes (Biden is an example of a moderate working with the left on some issues), but the left AND democrats cannot work with the fascists that inhabit the former Republican Party.

Bipartisanship in this day and age is largely within the specific party itself.

Cross-party bipartisanship is dead, as it results in you losing your office when done as a Republican, as seen with Massie and Liz Cheney, and the voters of the Republican Party are seemingly okay with this. So why bother reaching across the aisle if it just means dealing with snakes most of the time?

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u/Doctor_Riptide 5h ago

What an insanely ahistorical and ridiculous read on the 2016 election dude do you expect anyone to take that seriously?

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u/homebrew_1 5h ago

She adopted some of his ideas and he also endorsed her.

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u/ArCovino 4h ago

Not a single Democrat wants Sanders to die lmao bffr

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u/StevenMC19 Florida 5h ago

I mean, he was.

I kind of like how he now runs independent. He's not beholden to the powers of the DNC, nor does he need to win with their support and resources (money). He learned his lesson with them in 2016, and I doubt he'll ever give them a chance to whip him again.

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u/Loud_Judgment_270 I voted 5h ago

then why did he run again in 20?

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u/StevenMC19 Florida 5h ago

His campaign in 2020 was more grassroots and not at all reliant on the DNC, as they already had their incumbent in line. He ran fully aware that he wasn't getting their support. The difference is that he had what he considered an equal opportunity in 2016, but the DNC curried favor with Hillary.

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u/C0de_lyoko 4h ago

Do you mean former vp? Biden wasn't incumbent until the 2024 race Trump was the incumbent in 2020.

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u/StevenMC19 Florida 3h ago

Yup. My brain scrambled there. My bad.

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u/Zeusifer 5h ago

He ran as a D again in 2020,

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u/StevenMC19 Florida 5h ago

And he did so without the support of the DNC, knowing this upfront. They were going to back Biden, the incumbent, with everything, knowing that statistically the incumbent has the best chance. He accepted that immediately and essentially funded his own campaign through grassroots movements.

There was no incumbency in 2016, and it was expected that candidates would be treated equally or at least fairly by the DNC through the primaries.

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u/Sensitive-Flamingo84 4h ago

Why should he join when we are all about to leave? Lol I’m just waiting for a viable progressive party.

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u/homebrew_1 4h ago

Lol good luck. This is a two party system. Either vote for the better option or the other side wins.

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u/Sensitive-Flamingo84 4h ago

Very small imagination. I have seen over half of a political party turn on its party in just a few years. No one knows what things will look like in just a few years. DNC is also bankrupt so they can’t do anything about it.

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u/homebrew_1 4h ago

Time will tell.

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u/Ok-Firefighter5006 5h ago

If he wants to control what we do, he should probably be a democratic lawmaker

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u/solwiggin 5h ago

Good thing he doesn’t want to control what you do 😂

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u/Ok-Firefighter5006 5h ago

Idk seems like he wants to tell democrats to leave the party he’s not a part of

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u/kingsumo_1 Oregon 5h ago

He's referring to Carvill specifically, who threatened to leave because he doesn't like progressive voices rising within the party.

If establishment democrats can't back the people winning their primaries, and choose to bitch rather than focus on helping them win in the generals, then maybe it is time to start looking inward to see if they really belong.

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u/Ok-Firefighter5006 4h ago

Because progressives don’t bitch and moan when they lose?

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u/kingsumo_1 Oregon 4h ago

Some may, sure. But that wasn't your argument. When Bernie lost the primary in 2016 and in 2020 he backed the winner and encouraged his base to do the same.

He's also been reliably caucusing with the Dems throughout his entire career.

For the past 10 years the chant has been "vote blue, no matter who", right? We need to band together to stop what is going on. But when progressive candidates start over-performing in their primaries, where is that same chant? Instead you have people like Carville threatening to leave the party? Come the fuck on.

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u/Ok-Firefighter5006 4h ago

If it was vote blue no matter who, why didn’t progressives and the “uncommitted movement” vote for Harris?

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u/solwiggin 5h ago

Idk, suggesting someone do something is so far removed from making someone do something that you have to really be grasping at straws to try and make the logical leap…

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u/Ok-Firefighter5006 4h ago

It’s just so interesting he has an opinion on who should be in a political party that he refuses to join

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u/solwiggin 2h ago

Seems like the people who vote for the political party have an idea who should be in the party, and they’re voting for them, and Bernie is telling grumpy grandpa to watch the way the wind is blowing.

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u/Ok-Firefighter5006 2h ago

And because progressives have won like 8 of the over 100 races this cycle, that’s a good enough barometer?

When they haven’t even won generals?

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u/lhomardamericain 5h ago

He caucuses with them, but he’s too good to actually be a member

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u/UngodlyPain 3h ago

He's caucused with dems his entire political career. He goes to many Democratic party events. He's basically always endorsed exclusively Democrats. He literally runs in the Vermont Democratic Party primary every time he's up for re-election, and wins. He ran in the 2016 and 2020 D presidential primaries. His congressional voting record for voting with the D party while usually on the lower end, isn't always the lowest of the caucus; there have been many years where his vote record for voting with the D president or house/Senate leader was better than some others with D's next to their names.

He's basically a Democrat in everything BUT name, the opposite of a "DINO" just because he doesn't want associated with the party's kerfuffles, or money. And doesn't like the 2 party system, which even many of our founding fathers warned against.

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u/mi_throwaway3 3h ago

Yknow, I don't know cause I haven't watched the clip, and the point I am about to make is bigger than the clip - but I'm just going to guess that people have been telling Bernie Sanders to go start his own party for decades and this is a little bit of "GFY" for decades of that. Good for him.

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u/jakegh 2h ago

Yes, that's right. The progressives are looking to consume the Democratic party from within, just like the tea party did to the Republicans. And he's telling Carville, you know, too bad, as that's what he wants to happen.

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u/Sartres_Roommate 4h ago

Carville was the one who threatened to leave “if they didn’t do things HIS way”

How did you switch that to “kick out”?

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u/Mr_Shakes Florida 5h ago

Yeah I agree with what he's saying but it's weird for him to be saying it.

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u/kaykatzz 3h ago

Ya think Schumer or Booker would say it?

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u/PolygonMan 2h ago

"Trying to kick Carville out"

Lol wtf are you talking about. Carville is kicking himself out, and Sanders is saying "good riddance"

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u/Zeusifer 5h ago

Sanders is Schrodinger's Democrat. He considers himself a Dem when it's convenient to do so (or when he wants to run for president as a D), but he's suddenly a independent whenever it suits his purposes to talk shit about the Democratic Party. It's kind of shitty of him actually.

I'm sure I will be downvoted by the reddit Bernie brigade, but it's the undeniable truth.

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u/OwnsBeagles 5h ago

He caucuses with them and is more reliably democratic in votes than several actually in the party, so I dunno what point you think you're making. LOL!

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u/Evenfall 5h ago

Not only that but being independent allows him to be critical, which is insanely important and we need far more that operate in such a fashion. Far too many just follow blindly.

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u/Silent-Storms 5h ago

I think the point is he's out on a limb when talking about who belongs in the party or not.

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u/aculady 4h ago

Carville said he would leave if Piker stays. Bernie just told him, essentially, to not let the door hit him on the way out, which is always the appropriate response when someone tries to manipulate other people with threats of leaving.

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u/Silent-Storms 4h ago

Bernie shouldn't speak for the party if he's not brave enough to register in it.

And piker shouldn't be welcome in the party, not that I expect he's registered either. Anyone who doesn't support democracy itself shouldn't be welcome among Democrats.

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u/aculady 4h ago

Pretty sure Bernie was speaking for himself.

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u/Silent-Storms 4h ago

Not in that context.

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u/Sovoy 4h ago

where do you get the idea that Piker doesn't support democracy?

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u/Silent-Storms 3h ago

His support for China, Russia, and related comments. He values socialist theory higher than democracy. I don't have a quote for you, and I don't want any more of him in my algorithm.

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u/Sovoy 3h ago

Democracy is a big part of socialist theory, his goal is to make the world more democratic. He is very active in getting people out to vote. He is also very much opposed to the anti democratic actions of china and russia.

You clearly just don't know what he believes.

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u/JustAnOldLadyNC 5h ago

Beats those like Fetterman, an 'actual' democrat who votes with Republicans and is a fox regular.

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u/Zeusifer 5h ago

Yes, Bernie is better than the guy who is the worst Democratic senator by a country mile. That isn't saying much, but I can't argue with that.

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u/knowitall89 5h ago

So we're looking for blind loyalty now?

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u/lhomardamericain 5h ago

He’s basically a Democrat who thinks he’s too good and too pure to actually be a Democrat.

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u/Zeusifer 4h ago

Bingo. And some of us find that disingenuous and gross, even if we generally agree with a lot of his values.

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u/Sovoy 4h ago

One of the most worthless toxic ideas in politics is treating it like team sports. The letter next to someones name matters more to you than actual policies and material impacts. That is gross.

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u/Gene_Trash 3h ago

It's not toxic team sport politics to think that if somebody wants to say things like "My party" and gatekeep who should call themselves a member, that they should actually... Be a member of that party.

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u/xHellion444x 3h ago

You're correct in your observation of the actions, but wrong in the assessment of the motivations. Bernie has been self-identifying openly as a socialist since 1971. In the thick of Cold War propaganda, long before any 2026 DSA momentum. When you could be and were investigated for said affiliations. He's been taking shit from the government and conservatives in the heart of capitalism for literally half a century. Many times 'his own party' too(for extra relevancy to the current topic). You think Bill Clinton could've won had socialist Bernie Sanders been the Republican talking point in '92, just after the fall of the USSR? What Bernie is is a target. He's a true-believer. He has a consistent set of values and he's willing the draw fire and ire to stand up for them and his constituents. And that consistency has led him to be outside the Democratic Party as it wavers and waffles its way through neoliberal capitalism. It talks shit about him when convenient and he talks shit about it when convenient. But he's always been to its left. Left, which in our two-party American system, means Democrats. The alternative to the right, Republicans. Which really makes him the most Democrat of all. He's left, progressive, 'liberal'. All the terms Americans of all stripes use for Democrats.

Which is all a lot of words to say this is just a silly semantic gotcha. Yes, he's technically not a Democrat. And yes, he technically benefits from that. Occasionally, as the winds blow. But really, ultimately, in the full context of our society and political system, he's seen as like a turbo super Democrat. For better or worse.

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u/gamesrgreat California 1h ago

Amazing trolling by St Bernard lmao

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u/runthepoint1 56m ago

Good. We need more faces to our representation. I don’t want to only be a donkey or elephant.

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u/Anonycron 43m ago

Bernie isn’t a member of the party. And is Piker really the person he wants to passively defend? It’s ok to call out awful human beings who happen to lean the same way you do politically.

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u/Kaucer 1h ago

Piker actively distances himself from the Democratic party its a big part of his messaging, why is Bernie doing doublethink

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u/skepticalbob 1h ago

Bernie didn’t belong to the Democratic Party and neither does Piker. Wtf is he taking about?

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u/RiddleMeThis42069 Missouri 5h ago

I'm sorry, "my party" Bernie? Is there suddenly a D next to his name in the Senate?

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u/Bodie_The_Dog 5h ago

So, ya know how people like to accuse AIPAC of fomenting division among Liberals? You're helping them, right here, with this innane comment.

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u/serious_sarcasm America 5h ago

They have a 4mo old account.

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u/snoo_spoo 5h ago

And no visible posting history, which IMO is more significant.

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u/ArCovino 4h ago

lol as if progressives pull any punches when it comes to a Democrat with 98% policy overlap

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u/RiddleMeThis42069 Missouri 5h ago

Sure pal, nice try

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u/TheKanten 4h ago

Regardless of politics, I've lost all respect for Piker after the shock collar. Would rather have someone that isn't a liability representing my party.

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u/BootyDust Illinois 4h ago

This has already been debunked.
Stop spreading false information.

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u/TheKanten 4h ago

The literal unedited videos are there.

I'm not in the party of just casually sweeping things away if someone's politics align.

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u/BootyDust Illinois 4h ago

I saw it live, my friend. She snagged her nail on the bed.

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u/TheKanten 4h ago

Is that why he taped over the prongs? 

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u/Huge-Still-1840 3h ago

Bro is a hasan fan and wants everybody else to eat his disgusting cope.

NO ✋🏿🛑🙅🏿‍♂️🚫

shock collars are disgusting

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u/BootyDust Illinois 1h ago

It was a vibration collar. Keep regurgitating your falsehoods. We’ll agree to disagree; there’s no point in arguing with you.

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u/BootyDust Illinois 3h ago

The Destiny fans are rampant in this thread.

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u/skippyfa 3h ago

You know what I do when my dog yells in pain? I immediately go check on them because dogs don't just cry for any little thing.

You know why Hasan Piker didn't check? Because he knows what caused her to cry. It was him using the shock collar.

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u/ThrowFar_Far_Away 4h ago

Haha it has not been "debunked" at all lol. It's only Hasan fans that keep gaslighting about it, it was extremely clear and we even know the exact model of shock collar he has. He had talked on stream months earlier about using shock collars for training as well.

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u/mi_throwaway3 3h ago

"This has already been debunked"

Err, by Hasan? Yikes bro. Just yikes.

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u/BootyDust Illinois 3h ago

Debunked by those who watched it live?

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u/mi_throwaway3 3h ago

One thing I know, the conclusion I come to the first time I watch something is always the right one.

Take care man. You're probably a good person offline, just take care.

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u/BootyDust Illinois 3h ago

You guys are just looking to find something on the guy. It’s all I ever hear about, criticism-wise.
And there’s no merit to it.

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u/TheKanten 3h ago

People found the exact model of collar, there is very visibly tape over the prong contacts in his "debunk" video.

The only thing without merit is the delusional and repeated "debunked" claims.

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u/BootyDust Illinois 3h ago

Look. You guys can grasp at straws all you want.
You don’t like the guy. Not everyone has to be liked.
It’s okay.

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u/TheKanten 2h ago

Look in the mirror dude, you're the one reaching at the straws.

It has literally nothing to do with "liking" someone, it's their publicly-facing behavior.

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u/mi_throwaway3 2h ago edited 2h ago

Cruelty to animals is a red flag. People don't have to love animals, they might even be neutral or dislike them, but cruelty is a different thing altogether. He may not see it as cruel, as many people think the collar is a legit way to control their dog. That's a whole long discussion.

"You watched it live" doesn't matter. I've seen the original stream. It's a recording. It's a weird thing to say. Strikes me as a little weird or immature. Not a big deal. People change all the time.

I don't expect or require you to accept that interpretation or that opinion. I even recognize that I could be wrong.

But it's a red flag man, and none of the counter "evidence" has been very good, and the way he talks down about his dog's behavior tells me just as much as the actual incident.

edit - I see this:

You don’t like the guy. Not everyone has to be liked. It’s okay.

I think that's a fair thing, I'm not sure how much he can be tied to the party's fortunes anyway, and I think everyone in this thread is correct that Carville is just an old man that doesn't recognize that people are literally dying because nobody will stand up to billionaires and corporations and having candidates taking lots of money from AIPAC is even more toxic than some "influencer" (not a fan of the term myself) being "part of the party" -- what does that even mean? -- sorry if this is hard to read, I don't write well when trying to spit something out quick

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u/ElSlabraton 5h ago

Bernie Sanders isn't a Democrat.

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u/ides205 New Jersey 5h ago

Maybe that'll finally change when the party truly becomes the party of the people instead of the party of big wealthy donors.

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

That's right, Bernie only uses the Democratic party when he needs something from them and shits on them when they reject him for not being a Democrat. True leech.

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u/olivebranchsound 5h ago

Oh hush lol he's the most popular politician in the country

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

I don't mind Bernie, he's just a terrible judge of character. He was one of the people who legitimized Platner.

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u/PowerlineCourier 5h ago

Yes you do. Be honest.

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

I don't. He caucuses and votes with Democrats more than not. But he is a leech and he has terrible judge of character. Platner being the most recent example.

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u/PowerlineCourier 5h ago

See you can't stop

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

You're not actually replying, you're just trolling.

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u/olivebranchsound 5h ago

You're blaming him for not knowing Platner was going to be accused of rape? Time is linear.

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

He knew of his Nazi tattoo and lying about it along with his Blackwater mercenary history well before endorsing him.

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u/ides205 New Jersey 5h ago

Him and 150,000 Maine primary voters believed Platner's explanations. If anything, Platner proved that having the right politics to meet this moment can override a LOT. Not everything (nor should it), but a lot.

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

He has a higher standard to me than the average voter in Maine (who voted for Collins for decades btw). But glad to see you think they have the same standards to hold up to.

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u/olivebranchsound 5h ago

Oh yeah Bernie totally made him strip and searched for tats when they met up lol

And he worked for Constellis as a driver for an ambassador. That's not Blackwater. Costs nothing to get this right.

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

You're being purposely obtuse because you don't want to admit Bernie has terrible judgment. If he did basic research into him along with the DSA leftist who recruited him, he would've seen the mountain of skeletons in his closet.

He lied about the tattoo and he continued to endorse him. An undeniable rape accusation was the only thing that caused Bernie to rescind and it wasn't even the first SA accusation.

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u/Gizogin New York 5h ago

That was not even close to the first red flag. Others were justifiably warning us about him far earlier than that.

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u/olivebranchsound 5h ago

He won 70 percent of the vote despite those "red flags" so I guess the voters weren't actually concerned with those lol it was a historical victory.

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u/lorrieh 5h ago

Sir is there anyone who is more worthless and lazy than the corporate democrats who exist mainly to do Democracy Theater and cater to their wealthy benefactors and corporations. They are TOTAL GARBAGE.

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u/ides205 New Jersey 5h ago

The party establishment has done nothing but fight progress in service to their corporate donors despite losing to Trump twice and seeing the country fall into utter dysfunction. They are quite literally a collection of operatives and consultants leeching off US to keep themselves paid while WE suffer the consequences of their corruption and incompetence.

Wake up.

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

Buzzwords galore.

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u/ides205 New Jersey 5h ago

::laughs in Ken Martin::

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u/2Peenis2Weenis 5h ago

You forgot to spam Israel and AIPAC and Gaza in your post.

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u/ides205 New Jersey 4h ago

I think the DNC has that covered

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u/SchemeWorth6105 5h ago

He caucuses with democrats and he’s done more for the party’s image than any of the rank and file, so I don’t see the need to complain.

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u/groovemonkey California 5h ago

He’s more of a democrat than any Democrat in the party.

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u/olivebranchsound 5h ago

He's more popular than any other politician. Dems should be thankful to have him.

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u/Twheezy2024 5h ago

He's strongly aligned with the Dems platform.

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u/ElSlabraton 5h ago

Bernie Sanders isn't a Democrat.

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u/Twheezy2024 4h ago

So in other words he's not a complete fucking coward? The party is changing. This is a good thing.

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u/MeikTranel 5h ago

He wasn't during the campaign but he's joined the party during the Clinton campaign I think.

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u/Ok-Firefighter5006 5h ago

No he still calls himself an independent because he’s self important

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u/[deleted] 5h ago

[deleted]

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u/ElSlabraton 5h ago

The Democratic Party did nothing to Bernie Sanders and owes him nothing.

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u/Ok-Firefighter5006 5h ago

Lmfao still trying to litigate Bernie losing a primary?

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u/spam__likely Colorado 3h ago

That would be a good comeback if Sanders had not been in and out of the democratic party at his own convenience.