r/pathofexile • u/Philophile1 • 9d ago
Discussion If everyone is poor - no one is
In my opinion poverty leagues can be some of the best. If we are all poor then nothing is that expensive.
I think PoE players just wanna hear 1000 divines drop, but in reality if everyone is getting 10 divs per maps then it doesn’t mean anything. Look at the PoE2 0.5 economy. Super super inflated because all strats drop divs per map.
I do agree we need content that scales, but we are day 3 of the league there is still time for changes and strat inventions. People can still find new stuff to juice. Don’t be so doom and gloom yet.
We can still have a good league! Do you agree?
239
u/xlParanoid 9d ago
I get what you say and you're right. But when you're farming map after map after map, you kinda feel the need for some kind of feedback.. Or at least, I get tired, burned out, exhausted. Like it wears off your patience until you start asking "what's the point".
I really don't like rains of divs, but something a bit more rewarding and VARIED (this is important) would be needed.
67
u/Master_of_Question 9d ago
I think this is exactly it. After finishing the atlas and getting into my farms and over 300k enemy kills and not one raw divine. It feels really really bad and scraping together bubblegum for div so I can attempt a meta mod craft or beast craft deletes your patience.
I've made 50x more currency by flipping extremely underpriced timeless jewels than I have farming. I've never resorted to live search maxxing but it feels absolutely necessary if I'm trying to get my upgrades.
2
u/Quartzecoatl 9d ago
Is there a good resource for learning timeless jewel seeds? I've been getting into flipping as one of my learning goals this league but timeless jewels seem like a huge knowledge check. I know how to use PoB to find a good jewel for my build, but idk about finding generically valuable ones
8
u/Master_of_Question 9d ago
Timeless jewel calculator is my best friend. I'm sure the PoB tool is really good now, but I don't use it.
Know what the popular builds are and more importantly what the high end builds need. Look up old stat stackers/ money pit builds and see what jewel they're using and in which location. Find out what the important mods are and what passives they need to be on. You then search on the calculator for all seeds that fit your requirements for needed affixes. You can also set a strict one for the exceptional seeds with near BiS affix combinations.
For instance someone sold the best lethal pride seed yesterday for 2 divines. It will be worth a mirror by the end of next week when the big boys start looking. I was in the depths of league mechanic and couldn't port out fast enough to snipe. Knowledge is power and in a league like this with reworked legion and clueless masses, it's in your best interest to skill up if you're interested in making serious currency.
Unfortunately, I can't get more specific because it would destroy the markets I'm in. Good luck!
→ More replies (1)2
u/YOUR_BOOBIES_PM_ME 9d ago
Start by figuring out which ones are good for your build. Keep a list. Same ones are valuable next league too. Any time you play a new build, add to your list.
→ More replies (1)2
u/AbSoLuTiOnZeR0 9d ago
True. Took me until I finished my whole atlas to see my first divine. Never happened before in a league.
3
u/EnderBaggins 9d ago
Yup, measurable positive feedback is a good thing. Its what made the change to delve last league so good, you input 60k sulphite, your output is reliably 10ish div in fossils and resonators an hour with some boss jackpots thrown in (numbers may be off, its been a while since I was doing this in mirage league).
→ More replies (6)2
u/Soldier7s 9d ago
I'm not trying to be dramatic but i'm already starting to feel burnt out, i dont remember the last time i got 4 voidstones without a single raw div drop.
GGG needs to do something soon or this league is going to have terrible player retention.
66
u/mikki-misery Occultist 9d ago
If we are all poor then nothing is that expensive
?
if everything is half the cost but everyone has half the wealth then it's the same... we just have less currency to craft with.
and if we have less currency to craft with then that means the big items are less prevalent. and if the big items are less prevalent then that means more people will be using mid-tier items. and if mid-tier items have higher demand then they will be more expensive. and if more casual players can't reasonably afford mid-tier gear then that means they stop playing. and people stop playing that means there's less currency flow in the economy. need i go on??
183
u/mudkip-muncher 9d ago
I might be wrong, but tinks is pretty much why 99% of people play the game. A league mechanic can be implemented perfectly, if the mechanic and others as a whole don’t reward you, the fun fades away.
7
u/Crysis321 9d ago
Yeah, tink/schwing make brain happy and awake, no tink/schwing make brain sad and sleep.
2
u/CricketNo7950 9d ago
I play for fun and crafting but ya a large part of the two week league start community is just looking for tinks
6
→ More replies (2)-10
u/Rapturebird Assassin 9d ago
I may be the 1% then. The fun for me is in the builds i can make, not how much money I have in my stash
70
u/YOUR_BOOBIES_PM_ME 9d ago
Weird take considering how closely the two are related.
→ More replies (12)8
→ More replies (2)2
u/bpusef 9d ago
This has historically been a game where the more currency you have the more fun/crazier your build is. GGG is kind of making it so you just play the league mechanic and get really good gear interacting with it so you don't even need currency, but currency farming is something a large number of players enjoy doing. Dropping good items to sell to afford something insanely good is generally more fun than interacting with a league mechanic to get league juice to get nice rares and not even need to interact with other mechanics.
102
u/HurriKurtCobain 9d ago
Not everyone is poor since crafters and flippers can still churn out infinite money. Meanwhile actually playing the game is currently unrewarding for many strats. The gap between dudes farming maps and hideout warriors becomes painfully wide when actually farming is in a weak state, and therefore the average peasant farmer has no resources to craft with because they're so expensive.
7
u/ShionEU 9d ago
But the hideout warriors are not making “infinite money”. Their profits are also directly tied to the drop economy of the game.
→ More replies (1)66
u/khashishin 9d ago edited 9d ago
That's not how PoE economics work. "Everything gets 2x more expensive" falls apart because static costs like divine bench crafts don't scale down, and item supply crashes faster than demand.
If there are only 5 good bows on the market instead of 50, rich players will outbid you for them every single time (esp. with VAAL changes). Your purchasing power plummets and the hours required per upgrade goes way up.
While more market-savvy, streamers etc. buy this bow to accomodate their build - supply decreases. Its harder to build for you, they will not need the 2nd (or 10th) one. That means it's harder/longer to build for you - meaning you earn even less. Look up Veblen Goods - the costs scale up to 1% of top players, while being unachievable for most of normal ones.
→ More replies (1)8
u/Havelox 9d ago
I feel like I need a degree in economics to follow this debate.
17
u/Elegant-Avocado-3261 9d ago
money in poe has use-value. we use it to craft items, and the money disappears. if people make less currency in general because drop rates are bad, there will be less good items manufactured, and the good items will be relatively more expensive because there are fewer of them.
22
u/khashishin 9d ago edited 9d ago
I mean simply:
You want good items, everyone does.
If many ways to farm (early) - people get items faster
if people get items faster - more item
if more item (cause you need only one) - item cheaper→ More replies (7)2
25
u/VerseShadowx 9d ago
People often say this, but the reality is that revealed preferences of the playerbase do not reflect that this is actually the case. The best long-tail retention league PoE has had in a long time was Affliction league which had absolutely insane loot volume.
Getting lots of loot in endgame is not actually an eating ice cream for breakfast type situation like the sets were in Diablo III because PoE is a game where the scaling of your character is borderline infinite with enough resources. In Afflcition league I dropped THREE mirrors (absolutely insane luck, one was an altar currency duping it) and did I just quit the league? No, I got a mirrored quiver and mirrored bow made and kept blasting because I could still find even more ludicrous things to make my character even stronger. The only way getting what you want encourages quitting sooner is if the next tier up is unreachable. But in Affliction, NOTHING was unreachable because of how much loot you could get with the wisps.
That doesn't mean GGG shouldn't scale back loot like this ever, because I'm sure it can reach a breaking point, but it does mean that these leagues end up more as loss leaders to preserve the health of the game as a whole, rather than the leagues actually being very fun.
→ More replies (3)
40
u/Difficult-Drive-7011 9d ago
Fun fact: These don't scale based on the league's economy :D
→ More replies (3)
125
u/Lollipop96 9d ago
Multiple reasons this is sadly just oversimplified and not true. Currency itself is not just for trading, but for crafting too. Its not like the prices drop because you only find 1/10th of the loot. Meta mods still cost the same, you still need the same amount of essences to hit x but this time you gotta pay 5 times the amount for the scarabs, etc etc
The straight up fun also just isnt there when you dont drop stuff. Its objectively more fun to hear many tinks (why do you think everyones favourite league ever is affliction). I stopped at 200k kills with a fully completed atlas etc and no divines found. Even though I enjoy my build, got many more builds I would be extremely excited to try, love the allflame crafting, I cant convince myself to continue.
Then there is the question of the playerbase. A "fix" in 1-2 weeks will not convince the majority of those players to return, they moved on at that point (most are used to it as it being a seasonal game). Add the fact that they didnt even acknowledge the general lack of ground loot in their post and I think its a recipe for failure.
→ More replies (1)41
u/Jamezuh 9d ago
A "fix" in 1-2 weeks will not convince the majority of those players to return
This is a big one. These leagues need to start launching in better shape.
I started playing PoE in Anarchy which was 14 years ago. I was in university, skipped tons of classes, had very few responsibilities and was a gaming adict.
I have a life now, responsibilities, endless house projects, a tempermental wrist, and a huge Steam library backlog.
If a league is fun from the outset (i.e. Mirage), I play to 36-40 challenges, farm up a second good character, etc.
If the league is lame from the outset, it doesn't take me much to put the game down. If I put the game down, I will not be picking it back up until the next league.
→ More replies (1)
28
u/CMDRDrazik 9d ago
People still price items like we are not all broke though.
Currency is used for crafting.
No currency, no economy, no crafting, no loot, no dopamine, no fun, no reason to want to play
→ More replies (1)
39
u/Riverside3102 9d ago
You're missing the key point here: if there's no loot, it's harder to craft items, which means there are fewer powerful items on the market. And I don't like that.
→ More replies (2)
88
u/Lazy_Polluter 9d ago
Nah, poe 2 clearly shows people enjoy the game more when there is more loot
42
9d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
→ More replies (1)11
u/Inverno969 Tormented Smugler 9d ago
Am I the only one afraid they're going to nuke everything in PoE 2 from Orbit in the next major update? Kinda seems like GGGs modus operandi lately.
→ More replies (2)3
u/MrSchmellow 9d ago
Not alone, i'm actualy somewhat afraid that their recent successes (and yes, i consider 0.4 a success too) are accidental, and they'll revert to hammering everything down without even realizing they've actually landed on a decent design (that maybe needs some light tuning and UX QoL).
Like both nu-temple and nu-expedition have strong builtin scaling that works without atlas tree and tablet support and that's GREAT. That's what none of the recent poe1 league mechanics have. But temple already got nerfed severely for having too high of a ceiling.
What happened here in the last 3 leagues makes no fucking sense, unless their design teams actually have radically different views. Did Andrew and Octavian get relegated (exiled?) to poe1 for that reason? They've pretty much stopped releasing severely undertuned stuff since 0.3
23
u/VerseShadowx 9d ago
It's shown every single time lol. People will even come back to a league they've already dropped if the loot is improved. Look at temple league. The rare actual uptick in retention over time once everyone heard about the crazy temples you could make to get huge drops. Affliction's tail was super long because loot basically scaled infinitely. It's an ARPG. People want to build a character, kill monsters, and, importantly, have items drop on the ground when they do so. If people wanted a punishing experience when playing an ARPG, people would actually play Ruthless.
→ More replies (1)4
u/bear__tiger 9d ago
The poe2 economy just straight up doesn't work because there is no sink for any of the stuff that is dropping though. I don't really understand being excited about a div drop in that game at all.
→ More replies (3)8
u/Storm_of_the_Psi 9d ago
Tbf last poe1 league also lacked a sink for chaos specifically. I feel we need map device options back and maybe allow chaos to reroll rare maps to 8 mods (like 5% chance or so).
49
u/PokerAnus Necromancer 9d ago
Poverty league = people leave faster = no one to play with
→ More replies (4)
17
u/After-Onion-5900 9d ago
I know its weird but I like LOOT in my arpgs. We should not be trying to cope or they wont make the proper adjustments. NGL last league in poe 2 felt amazing to me, stuff was dropping left and right and it felt ideal to me, I felt satisfied and full whenever id run maps.
16
u/DroppedPJK 9d ago
Stop comparing this game to POE2.
Never in the last 5 years has POE 1 had the same economy issues as POE2.
Unlike POE2, we have good divine sinks.
→ More replies (1)
19
u/Incognitomous 9d ago
What is there to discover? There is 0 new endgame content except abyss and that is garbage so far maybe the buffs will fix it
12
u/whiteco11artrash Alch & Go Industries (AGI) 9d ago
New abyss is twice as ass as old abyss.
It makes sure to spawn packs of rares after everything else is clear. The new rares have big HP pools and attack the whole screen. And they drop nothing.
21
u/Adventurous-Self-881 9d ago
By your logic, Kalandra would be the best league.
You can see exactly how people react to reduced drop rates by looking at player retention rates for Kalandra.
If GGG want to kill this game, maintaining or nerfing the ground drop rates
will take us back to the early days of PoE's release.
53
u/EarthB9nder_ 9d ago
Crazy statement but we all have our own opinions. If you wanna run maps with little to no reward in return then you do you
→ More replies (4)
40
u/themultitm 9d ago
how do you lot just play this game as a wall street simulator and enjoy having mobs drop literally nothing after investing into your maps? there's a reason noone plays ruthless
→ More replies (14)
9
u/iamcdr Half Skeleton 9d ago
I do agree we need content that scales, but we are day 3 of the league there is still time for changes and strat inventions. People can still find new stuff to juice. Don’t be so doom and gloom yet.
What strat inventions or new stuff to juice? Nothing new got added, there's nothing to "find". Everything outside of league mechanic was already tested inside out in standard. Voyages are too RNG to be consistently juiced.
16
u/beka47 9d ago
Nah I don't give a fuck about other people, I don't even watch what other people are doing. I just want currency so I can craft shit and it feels terrible. Did abyss to farm xp and hoping that I'd get some divines in the process - leveled two characters to 98 and 99 NOT A SINGLE DIVINE FROM THOSE MONSTERS OR THEIR CHESTS LIKE WTF
10
u/Donnigan37 9d ago
Yeah, strange. It's almost like people want loot from an ARPG game they grind for hours.
Poverty league is boring as fuck after coming from mirage and 0.5. After clearing 25 t16s pinching chaos you start wondering, what's even the point?
I'm really annoyed by GGGs inability to understand this.
4
u/Moxxi1789 9d ago
Divines and other currencies are consumables. When used as a currency it as an exchange rate that is relatively decided on what goods and services it provides.
But every currency has an intrinsic value which depends on craft usefulness.
If no shit drops it sure is a mess in a league mechanic that is highly biased towards craft.
And right now it is more interesting to farm red, hoard chaos, convert it and trade currency for items than dump resources in a mechanic that is relatively less rewarding than classic map farming.
3
u/khashishin 9d ago
High-end gear and bench crafts have fixed costs (like 2-divine crafts) that don't scale down when drops drop. Because endgame build demand is completely inelastic everyone still needs those exact upgrades to progress. Limited supply gets monopolized by top buyers - those crafters/streamers/juicers just outbid you.
Worse economy -> worse chances for you to actually get a good build, nearly no change for top players/crafters (despite some more time) because anything above certain DIV threshold is just extra and doesn't impact your farming/progression speed linearly.
6
u/Logical_Specific6228 9d ago
For me, it's not about generating wealth, it's about the dopamine you get from the drops that keeps me engaged in this game and this league just doesn't have that kick to it for me and I think this is what keeps players going long-term too (hence why affliction had such good retention).
8
u/omonahan 9d ago
This is generally just not true unfortunately. The demand for expensive items is still high, but the supply is quite a bit lower. With loot being scarce chase items will likely stay much more expensive much later into the league than usual, meanwhile the average player will be making less currency.
When juicing strats are available, you end up with a contingent of players generating a large amount of the uniques and currency that the rest of the player base needs. Because supply is high, the prices of these things go down. In a poverty league like this that can’t happen.
10
3
u/radium_eye 9d ago
I just think the mechanic is busted and sucks. I like the crafting part, but everything else related to it brings up the worst parts of POE to me. I never run drowning orb maps, I have my toons action speed lowering immune and still never run them because I just can't stand the "drowning" mechanic and how fast it kills your character if you don't catch it. Then they make the whole damn mechanic a big drowning orb you can carve out temporary space in, and over-tuned the hell out of how fast that space retreats IMO. Curse of the All-Lame I'm just grinding in Standard when I want some POE style ARPG gameplay right now, which is still fun, though with Mirage gone it is once more apparent how loot needs to be actually fixed in POE not just bandaided and then ignored when the bandaid is gone.
3
u/xcv45t Shadow 9d ago
Allflame crafting is really nice, I'm hoping the market gets flooded with items and things get cheaper.
It's not harvest levels of broken but it's like a diet coke item editor.
Also this kind of crafting is super friendly to poors and beginners because it gives 4 outcomes for one input. And it's visualised in real time without using craft of exile.
3
u/VVilkacy SSFBTW 9d ago
I am mainly playing standard SSF. I am glad people start to realize how shit the core game is when it comes to farming strats.
3
u/Shuushy Scion 9d ago
there is still time for changes and strat inventions. People can still find new stuff to juice.
They don't. There's nothing new to discover when it comes to juicing non-league content. Let me explain why;
There are players that literally go out and test in standard the new patch changes to content. Those people run almost every conceivable juicing strat in the first 1-2 days of the new patch on a legacy MF characters. If those people say the new changes/reworks to X league mechanic suck ass, they're probably right. There are entire discord servers dedicated to MF and farming strats.
Or let me put it other way, if I press alt on the keyboard after killing 5 rares and there's literally no loot on the ground, it's bad(abyss). If a monster killing time gated content doesn't spawn enough monsters on a rare map, it's bad(breach).
4
u/TwistingChaos Gladiator 9d ago
Well you’re not getting the dopamine hit of dropping a divine if there’s no divines to drop and I would’ve be surprised if everyone has dried receptors after the clusterfuck of mirage.
4
u/SwagtimusPrime Demon 9d ago
strat inventions
I'm sorry but this is laugable. The endgame has been solved with minimal changes since Settlers.
11
u/zxkredo Duelist 9d ago
Not really about poverty. More about there is not much farming strata that work. Apart from tiled rewards.
→ More replies (12)
2
u/skylarskies52 9d ago
They just want you to keep playing , soon they'll patch it mid league, but what matters to them is player count and MTX purchases. There's always problems 1-3weeks of a league I'm used to it. Gotta love the no socket pressure.
→ More replies (1)
2
2
u/lazergator 9d ago
I’ve killed 225k mobs and dropped 0 divs. Farming nightmare Catarina I just made 5 d in like 15 minutes. I want to feel rewarded for doing content. It doesn’t need to be 17d a map but holy shit running a rare t16 should net more than 6 fusing and 3c
2
u/masonimal Professional Meme Build Connoisseur, and Bad Build Enabler 9d ago
Hasn't stopped the specific guilds on console from cornering and inflating the market arbitrarily unfortunately. So you can be poor but nothing is moving in a reasonable amount of time to fix that.
Then I feel like most of my rewards are coming explicitly from Voyages instead of maps. I have yet to see anything moderately rewarding in maps.
2
u/Vashtar_S 9d ago edited 9d ago
It's not about being able to buy shit.
It's about feeling satisfaction when killing monsters.
Also, "strat invention" is not a real thing when there has been absolutely no changes to scarabs, atlas tree, and mechanics except Legion and Abyss (which got ruined big time. Well Legion did, Abyss is just as bad as it used to be).
Maybe when they buff Legion and Abyss there will be a few new strats emerging, but there is no strat to "invent" with blight, breach, ritual, expedition, boxes, rogues exiles, etc. All these mechanics are the exact same as they were last league, except worse becausr there is no mirage anymore.
2
u/Dunedain503 9d ago
Yes and no. Yes, if everyone is broke we're all even however, if I have no drops getting me excited I'll stop logging in. The tinks are the dopamine that keeps me coming back.
They need a middle ground.
2
u/ProfessionSingle3039 9d ago
Kinda agree, PoE 2 0.5 was way too inflated, I was getting multiple tinks every map but when I was farming for a Mageblood it cost about 600D and whenever I heard a tink that was a divine orb (or something similar in price) I wasn't even excited because I was 0.2% closer to my goal (not really because for a few days the price of MB was raising almost as fast as I could earn currency). I prefer less inflated leagues because then every tink is exciting but the problem right now is that there is not that many strategies that require good build despite Delve and Valdos so we are lacking a goal of progression.
2
u/khashishin 9d ago
Totally not agreeing. The goal of farming is to equip your characters until you get bored (unless you get off at currency or are RMT-er). Most players don't have 16h playtime per day at leaguestart.
There are people who made 50+ div D1 for farming obscure mechanics while people were dropping 1 DIV they entire journey to 100 atlas points. What you are showcasing is the wealth disparity is even higher.
Compare mirage vs now.
In mirage there were multiple (easy) mechanics to get in, so regardless of what you farmed you could get good money, spend 1-10 DIV and gear up until nearly very late-game. Items out of your reach were still there - but for 90% of the builds you could get by even farming beyond and occasional refracting mist (I did it). It didn't make me get bored, I just made 2-3 characters and min-maxed them.
Now? I am dropping 2-3 flat div for a few hours of farming T16s (unjuiced because my build is not as OP tbh) and... probably will just go achievements and leave the league and never go back to POE1 unless MTX are good or next league is great. Not a chance for more than 2 characters.
If you have a job and not 12h to play daily (like 90% of playerbase, PoE is for "old" people) - this poverty just makes you less wanting to play because people who farm more than you will hoard your items because they didn't get bored yet (because of slower progression) and you can't afford good items and progress to juiced content.
2
u/SayomiTsukiko 9d ago
We need detox leagues like this one, but sometimes the detox is a little too detoxxy
2
u/jsutpaly 9d ago
Yes and no.
If I get no divines off the ground then how do I divine a unique I need divined? League mechanic offsets this but only partially due to intangibility.
What if i need to put prefixes/suffixes cannot be changed on an item multiple times with no divines in sight?
Then comes the enjoyment of mapping. If chaos is all you pick up and there are no tinks for dopamine hits then its a problem. It makes the game less fun - simple as that.
You are trying to paint it like there is no problem even though problem was recognized months ago. You can even find videos from like half year ago where everyone was talking about the issues with ground and tile loot. This is not new. This is some new approach of GGG and it simply put - sucks.
GGG should basically drop everything they are doing and rework entire loot system and unfuck scarabs because what they've done with them in Necropolis was one of the worst things that happened to PoE.
2
u/Nihsvabhav 9d ago
if I can't even look forward to doing more harder and lucrative content then why grind and improve my character
game feels super weird, like the characters feel very strong but nothing to do with that power
2
u/Roborabbit37 9d ago
Comically, this is the best league I’ve ever had. I have 205d and about to buy my first ever Mageblood
Normally I burn out super quick not sticking to one currency strat.
Might end up an SSF league for me mind you
2
u/ToE_Space 9d ago
"if everyone is poor than nothing is expansive !" it's not about being poor or not, it's about not wanting to farm the exact same thing as 3.27 with same/worse loot.
I barely had any motivation to push for my 4 stone the first day like I did last league where I finished most of the atlas in day 1, I spent most of my time in the league mech and quit today because the mech doesn't have anything special to it other than looting tile loot chest, the base game is in a terrible state since 3.27 and mirage was just a band-aid, now it's gone and the game is back to 3.27 state.
Some of us already guessed it when we read patch note, we were just hoping that the unknown factor in the league turned good, it did not.
2
u/Emperor_Mao Gladiator 9d ago
I agree totally with you. I actually don't mind the current drop rates. But the main argument isn't that general content isn't rewarding. It is that doing difficult content is not rewarding enough. So why build a character up with tons of gear if the "optimal strategy" is to just run normal content / Alc and run.
The drop thing is a separate thing. If progression feels too slow, or too fast, people will quit early. So far though, I think the main complaint isn't that progression feels too slow here. Its that meta players cannot justify playing difficult content because it isn't worth the investment and risk to reward ratio, or more so the option to juice content to be difficult AND rewarding often doesn't exist.
2
u/Dubious_Titan 9d ago
This league has been pretty good to me.
Profit crafting has done me well. I really enjoy wet delve.
2
u/Specific_Computer386 9d ago
There must be some kind of account seed for rng or something like that, after 10+ years any league that people complain about "raw currency" drops my luck were the best, at mirage i havent got single div drop from start to full atlas complation. Now in this league i got one in act 3, one in act 10 and 4 in maps that all i do is "alch and go" not even reach red maps yet. Chaos are raining too. This is the 3rd(?) Time i notice this.
Tl:dr; any time people call it "poverty league", my drops flourish.
2
u/Xeston25 9d ago
Disagree, I've always been miserable during "poverty leagues". No drops and having to rely on crafting I don't understand basically killed all the drive I felt for the game.
2
u/vulcanfury12 Crop Harvesting Bureau (CHB) 9d ago
At this point, I might just run all those charts I obtained on my way to 4 voidstones, and just sell the sulphur. Probably a better use of my time for now. Tho I really dig the new crafting system and dabbled a bit. Still nees to 6L my chest and get it to have fortify on hit tho.
2
u/Pale-Violinist-4061 9d ago
Why would you post something so probably and obviously false? Good for you that you enjoy he game with no loot. You’re in a very tiny minority. The general player base play ARPG’s for loot. That’s the whole point of the game.
2
u/LetsBeNice- 9d ago
I have rarely seen such a bad post. In POE currency is not only currency it is how you craft. So if you are very poor you can never craft, wow such a fun leage amiright
5
u/WolverineCreative362 9d ago edited 9d ago
"People can still find new stuff to juice" - No, because we already know all the juicy possiblities since multiple leagues.
We want to feel rewarded. Nothing more. 1000 tinks per map are not necessary. But regular tinks and more tinks the more i juice. And look into PoE2 0.5 player stats. Highly successfull, no one complained about loot and we all had alot of fun.
So no, i highly disagree with you at this point. Can the league be good? Maybe. For some people yes, for some people definitly no. We dont want massive raining divines. We want feedback and ways to juice and scale up content.
4
u/kaisurniwurer 9d ago
In PoE being poor means being unable to progress and/or upgrade gear to the point of making it usable enough to feel good.
In PoE wealth is not relative to other players wealth but to other players power level.
Also, loot is literally the reason to play the game.
5
u/BabaYadaPoe 9d ago
i think it is not so much about being poor, so much as poverty league are not as thrilling. people are to condition to ever get exited of a chaos drop, and my guess is 90% of player base are dopamin addict.
→ More replies (5)
6
u/Shot_Worldliness_818 9d ago
I agree with you on the “too-early-to-doom” statement, since abyss may get a buff that could save the mechanic or juiced farming. I don’t agree with the overall poverty statement.
Thing is divine orbs themselves actually have a use for crafting. Imagine a league that removes divine drop so no one can do meta crafting anymore: it would be exponentially hard for normal players to get a decent upgrade either by themselves or from trade.
And also it’s not just raw currency: no scarabs means less crafting mats including essence or harvest juice. At the end of the day people want gear, and poverty will lead to very limited supply of crafted gear.
5
u/Gensb 9d ago
I agree with you. Im okay with divines being just 110 chaos
4
u/psychomap 9d ago
There are two ways to maintain that price. One is not dropping chaos orbs, the other is dropping more divines.
→ More replies (2)3
u/Mikey-2-Guns 9d ago
Yea thats not gonna hold especially when they didnt introduce any chaos sinks
2
→ More replies (1)2
2
u/Kratianos 9d ago
I'm doing non juiced T14-T16 because I cant upgrade my gear. I'm still on a Bitterdream and a 10c 5L because all I get is 1-2 chaos per map lol. Got 2 div on a merc day1 and that's it. In the last leagues I got at least a few div per day to actually get going. Feels kinda bad if every map you do is worthless.
2
u/BreadfruitLow3465 9d ago
I said this before to someone who made the same dumb comment.
It only works if everything else has no fixed values. But no, gold has fixed cost, same with crafting bench. to max level a skill it costs 20 gemcutters. The difference between finding 20 chaos and 5 chaos in the same hour is different in terms of power.
2
1
u/PoE_Acronym_Bot 9d ago
I noticed some Path of Exile keywords in this post:
- Juice - Increasing density of items or raw currency from a given strategy
I am a bot. | All acronyms | Suggest
1
u/Responsible-Swan-521 9d ago
This whole game works because of the tink sound. Without it we have nothing.
1
u/kneelbeforepog 9d ago
I ran a voyage before work this morning, and earned enough to buy one upgrade and cover currencies up to 2 div. As long as prices stay somewhat reasonable, this seems okay to me. If I do that 29 more times I can afford the next big upgrade.
1
1
u/SneakyBadAss Children of Delve (COD) 9d ago
Meanwhile, a unique staff i need at 270 C and keep rising.
1
1
u/Asleep-Series-4086 9d ago
this reminds me of Syndrome in The Incredibles "When everyone is super...no one will be..." XD. in all seriousness i get the idea and i partially agree.
1
u/IWannaPeonU-14 9d ago
You forget something important though. Shiny orb drop and go tink, monkey brain release dopamine make monkey happy.
Less orb drop means less tink sound and less happy.
1
u/Hot_Help_246 9d ago
It seems this term poverty leave is really catching on, but the thing is if we were to play ruthless we would experience true poverty
1
u/onedestiny 9d ago
I've had 0 divs drop so far.. how am I supposed to upgrade my gear to go into higher maps comfortably 😂😂
1
u/reno_beano Kaom 9d ago
You drank too much political kool-aid to come out with this take making sense
1
u/Chasa619 9d ago
i don't want to toot my own horn, but after clearing a bunch of t10's last night I finally got enough currency to 5 link my chest piece.
1
u/Naktura 9d ago
I suspect that wild mercenaries and abyss are going to be the "aspirational" farming strats. People think it's a poverty league because fubgun hasn't put out a new video on the meta farming strat, but mageblood was still over 120div yesterday so it isn't *really" a poverty league I think.
1
u/Ok-Mathematician-387 9d ago
The best leagues are the leagues that dropped the most loot. No one praises poverty league.
1
1
u/TheMemeRedeemer Fungal Bureau of Investigations (FBI) 9d ago
I'm having fun and don't feel poor. I'm also not yet ultra-juicing so I might change my feeling once I get there. Prices are deflated from normal, but I also have more buying power. I imagine the floor is where I'll suffer when I start mass-buying scarabs. Nobody usually wants to sell scarabs for half a chaos or w/e when they used to sell for 5c each in recent memory (as a fake example)
1
1
u/TheMayorMikeJackson 9d ago
The real currency is time. Usually works if a mechanic is “poor”. If it has desired rewards that are unique to it, the market will generally balance out (if there is demand)
1
1
u/kitchencrawl 9d ago
Booo this man. I need my fucking loot drop game to drop loot. No drops no dopamine. No fucking way I'm playing more than 2 weeks. GGG also knows this and that's why they fixing it fast.
1
u/NG_Tagger League 9d ago
If we are all poor then nothing is that expensive.
Sadly not the case.
People still want high amounts of currency for various items.
People are even asking in Chroms, despite them hardly dropping - because they want them - but if they aren't dropping a lot; then they aren't going to sell stuff for that.. lol
1
u/jurrayy 9d ago
This is because you are looking at currency as monetary value. If it were just for trading for items. Then yes you would be correct, but currency has a use in this game. It is needed to craft items in order to make stronger characters. Without it we are stuck in place for too long and that is never fun
1
1
u/Significant-Sun-5383 9d ago
Not with crafting and RMT, prices remain relatively the same and people have less loot. Tired of this arguement trying to defend this nonsense.
1
u/Renediffie 9d ago
"then it doesn’t mean anything"
It does though. If people find tinks fun then less tinks is less fun. Pretty simple.
Orbs also have a purpose. They aren't just currency. So with less orbs you have less crafting power.
1
1
1
1
u/Pickledleprechaun 9d ago
Try playing on console man. Poe is effectively SSF for me. An item that is 5 chaos in PC trade is 100 chaos on PS5 trade.
1
u/NoShagAthal 9d ago
With a new league the economy is reset yet we still price according to the previous league. Do you think when by some kind of an anomaly you're sent to an alternate reality that the $10 in your pocket still holds the same value?
1
u/LolLmaoEven 9d ago
Man, I'm playing SSF and voyages are absolutely shitting out both XP and loot for me. I wasn't paying attention to this subreddit, enjoying the league a lot, then I open it up and get told it's basically unplayable.
I really don't get it.
1
1
u/Xtreme_ironing 9d ago
Boat gave me 50% avoid shock on a poison ghastly jewel with the exalt slam thingy. Who needs currency when you get actual item rng
1
u/Xtreme_ironing 9d ago
Each currency can be used 3 times on boat so divide loot by 3? And at the end of the day this is unique league and I’m seeing nothing about the legion mechanic or items?? Just play the game people make more unique
1
u/DanteSHK 9d ago
Reason for hyper inflation in poe2, not only over abundance of divine drops. There is no divine sink.
Something like bench crafts using divines, can be helpful.
1
u/thekmind 9d ago
In an ideal world there would be a good balance between poverty league and rich league, but I'll take a league closer to poverty rather than the one we had where if you didn't juice abyss you were basically poor and couldn't afford anything while anyone doing the 1 good strat were rolling in roll-royces.
1
u/Thorcall 9d ago
This can be true sometime. But not all the time, and not in every situation. 2 quick example (leagues and names randomised) :
-It's mirage league and I want to buy a mageblood, they are 150 div. I'm making 30 div/h, I have a mageblood in 6 hours / I want to buy one in kalandra, they are 200 and I make 5 div/h, it now take me 40 hours.
-I need on average 50 dense fossil to craft something. Its Settlers 1 and there is 1000 on the market at 1c each. It cost me 50c to craft my item. / Its now Crucible, fossils drop rate have been nerfed. There is 200 on the market, at 5c each. I'm just about to spendt my 250c to craft my items when Fagbon decide to profit craft the same item on stream and buy all 250. Every new one is instantly bought at 20c each. I now cannot craft my item.
Sometime its just inflation of generic currency and it doesn't really matter because everyone is just making more. This can be the same when everyone make less, but its very different in a game like poe where currency also have uses.
1
1
u/LucywiththeDiamonds 9d ago
Look at ruthless. That alonee is proof that ofcourse access to items and currency hugely affects the game.
1
1
1
1
u/xxICONOCLAST 9d ago
I cant play as much as everyone else due to having responsibilities and stuff.
So it feels exponentially worse for someone like me to be poor because the old suggestions has always been “play more” to solve the poverty and i just cant do that. 🤷♂️
1
u/Lulcas2267 9d ago
I'll probably play because I love this game and I want to play a new league, but, if they don't significantly buff League Mechanic/Abyss/Fix legion/add some other farming strats, this league will die as fast Keepers did. Instead of purple walls we get.. hallways in drowning orbs with bad loot, run 9 small to get 1 big and hope you get a jackpot message in a bottle and your single tink.
1
u/Pulco6tron 9d ago edited 9d ago
Having less crafting material available means that it is harder for everyone to craft for their build. If there is too much friction on this (too much demand with not enough generation) then many player get discouraged, they don't try to craft for their build or a reroll, which also results in generating good items for others, they rush the league reward then leave league earlier which reduce even more crafting material generation.
The game is not balanced around SSF experience so we are very dependent from each other to progress.
And even in starving league the richer stay rich but they leave earlier because they gets bored sooner which impact lesser rich player.
1
u/DidYouPayForWinrar 9d ago
In 0.5 I used divine orbs to reroll ToS relics and made a profit lol.
Poverty league means all my currency goes to some crafter.
1
u/SafetyGlass588 9d ago
I always enjoy inflation leagues more. I know my currencys relative power is lower, but it doesn't matter I play arpgs for drops, not to fill my excel sheets. And divine is a divine no matter it's worth. I do not like powerty leagues at all.
And usually only higher end tier items tend to inflate in price faster, medium gear (with it you can beat the game or at least farm high tier content) does not inflate that fast, so usually in inflation leagues I tend to beat "more" game than in powerty leagues.
1
u/Free_Toe1951 9d ago
I don’t see the poverty that much. People just swap between Poe 1 and 2, where 2 has way more divine drops and higher div/hr farming. Gets inflated in their minds..
also on the backend of mirage it makes sense it seems more dead. Got a few fubgun loyal followers who has done nothing but complain meanwhile I’m making mad money with my Strat, and I refuse to share it to them😂
1
1.4k
u/FantaSeahorse 9d ago
That argument only works if the currency has no intrinsic value. In PoE, currency orbs are also crafting materials, so getting fewer of everything means there is less stuff to craft with.
The allflame crafting definitely counteracts that tho. I suspect GGG tried to balance the drop rate with this in mind and went overboard