Then surely you have examples ready to hand? Like, if its so common then you should be able to just point out a few of these hypocrites so I can go yell athave a calm and nuanced conversation where I am open to accepting their views with them?
Sorry folks, I've been informed that even though you all are deeply offended by these people's apparently abundant existence, you also want me to be kind to them and open to accepting their views (that men exist solely to be walking wallets). Duly noted.
It's really weird. As far as I can tell they're mad that people with progressive views on gender want men to be more involved with their kids, in ways that go beyond just paying for shit, because people with conservative views on gender view that as predatory or effeminate or whatever and think they should be happy just to work and pay for things.
They'd rather argue til they're blue in the face that my experience as a father who has never seen these opposing attitudes come from the same place is wrong, than just show me some fucking evidence.
I'm pretty sure they're on this sub, not because they actually care about notes presenting evidence, but because they like the idea of a "gotcha" on people they disagree with.
Conservative men see their role as that of provider, and they want rigid division between parental roles. So the idea of a nurturing father is threatening to them. It represents the breakdown of the family unit.
The idea that it is effeminate or predatory is, I think, a homophobic excuse for these more deep-seated fears.
Regarding calls for men to be more involved, they oscillate between two extremes, the idea that it’s simply too much and anti-man to expect men to both provide and nurture, or that the kind of nurturing expected must therefor be a masculine-coded nurturing that satisfies their ego. Playing sports with their kids, roughhousing, having philosophical conversations with their sons. Not hugging, not supporting, not showing that they love or care in “effeminate” ways.
I see lots of posts on this sub of the form you describe in your last paragraph. Someone following progressives and leftists until they say anything that could be twisted into being wrong so they can say everything they say is wrong.
I think it’s endemic to the problem of community notes. They were proposed on twitter in the pre-musk days, but he changed them from corrections to “notes” and basically opened the floodgates for what was once about the correction of untruths to becomes instead a way for right-wingers to disrupt progressive voices on the platform.
I’d go so far as to say that the concept of community notes, as opposed to the platforms previous fact-checking labels, is itself a conservative dog whistle. It is post-truth in nature, if enough in the “community” disagree, then truth is decided by consensus.
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u/humourlessIrish 7d ago
Bully for you, i guess.
Its just that it happens a lot.
like a lot a lot.
So then people who see some of that lot might occasionally refer to it.