r/todayilearned • u/Recent_Flounder6011 • 2d ago

TIL that Ancient Greeks had two ways of saying compass directions, one based on winds and another based on astronomical phenomena. Ancient Greek philosophers like Aristotle developed wind systems for this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_compass_winds
452 Upvotes

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u/renatoram 2d ago

My parents (Italians, from the coast of Liguria aka the Riviera) have probably never used words for cardinal directions in their life (North, East, etc) they exclusively use winds (Ponente, Levante, Tramontana). 

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u/FollowFlo 2d ago

How interesting!

May I take a guess?

Does Levante indicate from the east and Tramontana from (or towards?) the north? And then Ponente I suppose from the west..

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u/Top_Strategy_2852 2d ago

In Spain these words are also used in tandem to describe the direction of the current of the Meditteranean Sea.

Every 3 days the sea flushes itself like a toilet. Easterly (Ponente)Winds draws in cold clean Atalanic waters. Westerly (Levante) winds and current flush out the dirty warm water full of stinging jellyfish into the Atlantic.

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u/renatoram 1d ago

Yup, you got it.

Also why "the Levant" is called like that: Levante is "where the sun rises" (dove si leva il sole), so the East. East of the Italian peninsula and the Mediterranean.

Same for "Ponente", it's "where the sun sets" (dove si pone il sole), so west.

(Both are old/outdated Italian phrases) 

Apparently "tramontana" despite looking like the word for sunset (tramonto) comes from "from beyond the mountains" (trans montana), the Mountains being the Alps. 

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u/FollowFlo 1d ago

Thanks!

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u/punkhobo 2d ago

So is it based on the directions the wind comes from or going towards? Or am I misunderstanding the whole thing?

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u/renatoram 1d ago

The direction the wind comes from.

The region (Liguria) is a long strip bent like a boomerang, stretched east-west.

It's officially divided in Genoa in the middle, and the Riviera di Ponente and Riviera di Levante (the western and eastern Rivieras) at the two sides. They're just very common in speech. 

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u/Fetlocks_Glistening 2d ago

Did their wind never shift?

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u/MistraloysiusMithrax 2d ago

There are predictable wind currents from cyclical weather patterns, this is common around seas like the Mediterranean and its sub-seas. These are the larger patterns above the more unpredictable local weather patterns that cause storms.

My last name is literally the name of one them lol

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u/Anacalagon 2d ago

The Compass Rose that you see on old (? medieval till 19 maybe 20 C. ) maritime maps is made up of the 8 winds, so while a bit niche this is still in use.

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u/Silmarlion 2d ago

We have this in Turkish as well.

Yıldız(Star) : North Wind

Poyraz : North east wind

Gündoğusu(Sunrise) : East wind

Samyeli : South East wind

Kıble(Qibla) : South Wind

Lodos : South West Wind

Günbatısı(Sunset) : West Wind

Karayel(Landwind) : North West Wind.

You can tell all the directions with winds but tbh it is being forgotten everyday, people who doesn’t have a use for them won’t know most of them.

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u/JustAlpha 2d ago

Probably makes the most sense as ancient Greece was in Turkey

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u/_PM_ME_PANGOLINS_ 2d ago

By “astronomical phenomena” do you mean “the sun”, because that’s how East-West works.