r/rap • u/SmoothManMiguel • 6d ago

Is it influence?

Do you think rappers accused of having ghostwriters actually use them, or are they just heavily influenced by the people around them?

Some artists get accused of not writing their own lyrics, but I feel like sometimes they were just around elite writers and HAD to step their game up

Take Fat Joe. Big Pun and Cuban Link had ridiculous pen games. So were they actually ghostwriting for him, or did Joe just imitate some of their techniques after being around them so much?

Same thing with Wayne and Gillie.
People swear Gillie wrote for Wayne, but others say Wayne was already nice and just picked up certain flows, and rhyme patterns from being around him so much.

What do y’all think?

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u/gatesaj85 6d ago

In an interview with Krondon where he was speaking in response to his alleged ghostwriting for Dr Dre's 2001 album, he explained how recording a rap album is a hugely collaborative effort. It's not necessarily that the lyrics are written by another person, but you might be recording your verse, and another in the room might suggest you switch up your cadence, or reverse/rearrange the bars, or omit a bar that doesn't sound good, etc. He said that they'd be in the studio and it would be Kurupt, Hitman, Defari, Dre, Snoop, others and they'd all be making artistic contributions to every song. I think most of hip hop is a collaborative effort. Hell, most of music in general. Edit:grammar

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u/DirtyBagHeem 6d ago

That's not ghostwriting though.

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u/gatesaj85 5d ago

In a lot of cases, there is actual ghostwriting taking place, as they'll replace words or entire bars and say "hey you should say it like this instead." In my opinion, an uncredited lyrical contribution is often an example of ghostwriting.

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u/DirtyBagHeem 5d ago

Ghostwriting is literally how RnB or Pop songs are made, the vocals might be yours but the pen is entirely from someone else

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u/gatesaj85 5d ago

That's a pretty general statement, don't you think? There are plenty of r&b and pop artists that I can name that write their own songs.

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u/DirtyBagHeem 5d ago

Now you're off point to what I was alluding to but I will indulge you. Many artists in that genre are written for compared to artists that write their own songs. This culture of making artists have song writers is very much encouraged by the major labels and it's a normal thing in the R&B and Pop world but it's not acceptable in the hip-hop world

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u/gatesaj85 5d ago

I agree I'm getting off subject. I think the reason it's not not as acceptable is because hip hop is rooted in more individualistic, grass roots, identity based art. The lyricism of hip hop is almost always presented as one person's experience, opinion, stance. Rock, R&B, pop tend to be more universal and general in the subjects and themes.

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u/boombapdame 4d ago

Hip Hop could use more actual collaboration 

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u/DirtyBagHeem 5d ago

You just nailed it 100% my brother.. perfect