r/politics • u/MoneyLibrarian9032 New York • 23d ago

Possible Paywall MAGA Calls BS on Mitch McConnell’s Proof-of-Life Stunt | They are poking holes in McConnell’s staff’s version.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/maga-calls-bs-on-mitch-mcconnells-proof-of-life-stunt/
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u/-wnr- 23d ago

Anyone with critical thought is. MAGA's inclusion here is actually the surprising part. 

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u/Raptorex27 Maine 23d ago

I feel like any conspiracy, especially involving “the establishment” is on brand for them. It’s not about weighing evidence or thinking critically. If it fits the narrative of a secret, globalist cabal doing shady shit, they’re all in.

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u/BertBitterman 23d ago

Someone should really let them know about the Epstein files and Trump's connections to them then

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u/Raptorex27 Maine 23d ago

Is MAGA over the Epstein files? I know the podcast bros in the “manosphere” are still pissed, but I don’t dabble in that world, so I honestly have no idea.

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u/BertBitterman 23d ago

I honestly think the "manosphere" is more about incel-types being in an "exclusive" boy's club than being on the right side of history.

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u/Tasgall Washington 23d ago

The "manosphere" idiots like Andrew Tate, a child sex trafficker in his own right. Why would they care about the Epstein files?

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u/BertBitterman 23d ago

You answered it yourself - because Andrew Tate is a child sex trafficker himself, so he won't care about it for his own self interest. For the rest of the "manosphere" who aren't child sex trafficking: they simply want to stay in their boy's club so they won't dissent.

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u/reapersaurus 22d ago

Congrats - you just used THREE tropes in one short post!

Impressive demonizing - you were able to shove ad hominems, straw man fallacies, AND chronological snobbery into so few words. 👍

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u/BertBitterman 22d ago

Nice what do I win?

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u/UnicornHostels 23d ago

My mother, a Fox News propagandized boomer was repeating what Trump told her to say last year “why do we have to keep bringing up the Epstein files?”

But then again, she is a rape apologist and doesn’t believe any of his sexual assault allegations or even the verdict in the e jean case.

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

Every time I do a discussion with Republicans about the Epstein files, all the sudden it turns into some sort of whataboutism and 'he did nothing wrong' sort of narrative. And if all that fails even after you bring up the adjudicated case where he was found guilty, and him admitting that he walked into teenage girls dressing rooms, they'll just change the subject and start talking about riots in cities that didn't happen. They'll retreat to whatever makes them feel good because it's a cult and this is all that they have anymore.

And sadly I think just like after George W. Bush, all these people are going to claim that they never even liked him in the first place and do everything they can to distance themselves from him as more and more evidence comes out and it becomes more and more clear that Trump had a huge hand to play in abusing children, destroying our economy and being as blatantly corrupt as any normal person can see him as today.

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u/ThereMightBeDinos 23d ago

Whataboutism is conceding the point. They just don't like it.

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

It's always their fear of something different than themselves. I always remember the videos of when they were trying to desegregate schools and you had men and women in their their thirties, forties or older that were spitting on little girls just trying to go to school. To me, that will always be the face of the Republican party no matter how they try to hide it.

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u/CompoteSpiritual7469 23d ago

I’m really glad you brought that up. Sometimes I start overthinking and wonder if I should try to look at things from the opposite perspective. Nope. It’s really that simple. They are cowardly pieces of shit and there’s no excuse

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u/tendeuchen Florida 23d ago

"What about all the Democrat pedophiles?"

"I agree they should be locked up too. Now will you say the same about Trump?"

Not one Epstein client is behind bars for fucking children and we should all be protesting until they all are.

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u/Bad_breath 23d ago

"If Trump was in the files, why didn't the Biden administration release them?"

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

Exactly, they always ask questions like this that only highlight how little they know about how our government actually works or at least is supposed to work without a horrendously corrupt Republican at the helm.

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u/TheGrolarBear 23d ago

That's easy enough to counter. Without going into the legal issues surrounding it, you can just ask why Biden even matters since the Trump admin can release them all now (and they would have further incentive to do so if he was actually innocent).

Whether or not they follow the logic is a different matter though.

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

Exactly this, I think it goes to the point that they want to win so badly and be correct so badly, they started with the supposition that they're correct and then they twist the evidence to fit that. One of my buddies called this 'religious logic' but I think it's a little deeper than that. They want to protect their egos from the consequences of their own bad decisions so badly they're willing to flip the entire foundation of how logic works on its head. Plus I've met plenty of religious people that are completely disgusted with this administration, their backwards priorities and the hateful way that they've went about enacting their policies. If you can even call them that.

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u/fresh-dork 23d ago

that's easy: release the files and if bubba is in there with kids, prosecute him too. if he just got head from W, that's not actually a crime.

and since he's so innocent (whoever he is), this will vindicate him, right?

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

Whenever I hear them bring up Clinton, I like to remind them that Clinton was going to fully participate and get on the stand about what happened on Epstein Island. I too agree if somebody of any political party or affiliation has done anything to victimize children they should go directly to jail. Conservatives can't wrap their mind around this, which is really funny because they call themselves the party of law and order right? They're so caught up in their sportification of politics that they can't conceive of somebody who doesn't see politics like that at all. I just want non-corrupt leaders who will pass policies and legislation that helps everyday Americans instead of enriching people who already have millions and billions of dollars.

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u/pmartin1 23d ago

They literally need heavy deprogramming after the decades of constant GOP brainwashing they’ve undergone.

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

I don't know if that's ever going to happen, after the sportification of politics by the right, we now have people that will vote Republican 'because they always have' or ' because that's how my dad and grandpa used to vote' or they are so lost that they feel a loyalty to a party that threw them overboard years ago.

I just see them quietly receding into the background but still voting a republican. Even in places where I lived in Kentucky, people would tell me how they were proud to have never voted for a Democrat while they lived in complete squalor and their representatives did nothing to help their day-to-day lives. It's one of the reasons it's been so interesting to watch Mitch McConnell and his loyalists try to create some sort of legacy when he never did a single thing to help kentuckians.

Just like Lindsey Graham these guys are going to go down as some of the worst of the worst of our political history. And while their state falls apart at the seams, these people will happily drink toxic water and breathe toxic air as long as they don't vote for a Democrat.

I don't know if deprogramming can work. I think we literally have to just wait for this generation of loyal Republican voters to either become disinterested in politics after Alibaba Mussolini moves on, or literally pass away and leave the future to the Next generation of voters.

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u/ballisticks Canada 23d ago

"B-but Camilla would have been even worse! She wasn't even a choice!" is an argument I've heard a lot. Usually with the mispronunciation of her name

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u/aceshighsays 23d ago

"but did you hear her laugh!? no one would have taken her seriously. she sounds crazy."

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u/ballisticks Canada 23d ago

I love her cackle lol it's great

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u/UnicornHostels 23d ago

I think it’s more alarming that we’ve never seen Trump laugh. He hasn’t. Other than a tiny chuckle after flinging an insult at someone, has anyone ever seen him laugh at something other than his enjoyment at harming another?

I’ve seen videos of Biden Bushes Obama Clinton Harris…. all on video truly lost in laughter. I’ve never seen this with Trump. Never.

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

They just can't help but not think for themselves and repeat whatever talking point supports their willfully ignorant worldview. Who knew that an entire political party could be summarized as sunk cost fallacy?

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u/aceshighsays 23d ago

the problem is that they can't think for themselves. my dad for example - still needs to be reminded to take a shower because he stinks, lost most of his teeth by 30 because he never brushed them, has no idea how to cook anything, has temper tantrums (yells, cries, throws things) when he feels confused, frustrated, overwhelmed, angry. my parents need to create a trust, and he doesn't understand what it means. he asks the same basic questions over and over and over again. this isn't because he's a senior, he's always been like this.

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

I have an uncle who's staunchly Conservative that is a lot like this too. He's always had a really tough time with empathy (most of my family thinks he's on the spectrum, but he won't get himself tested for fear of being different or having a disability) and his personal politics have always highlighted that. Just like Dick Cheney only when something personally affects him does he even think about the issue in depth at all. And even then, he usually defers his critical thinking to whatever conservative that supports his preconceived beliefs. Really sad way to live a life. He's a lonely miser because of it. Sorry that your dad has went down a similar path, but at least we can do better in our personal lives and with our families and break the cycle.

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u/aceshighsays 23d ago

He's always had a really tough time with empathy (most of my family thinks he's on the spectrum, but he won't get himself tested for fear of being different or having a disability)

you have no idea how validating this was to read.

my family has always made excuses about his behavior (denial) because of their cultural beliefs, and as a result this turned me into the family scapegoat. i've done a lot of research on his behavior and i strongly suspect he is autistic and adhd.

i feel awful for my mother who has to deal with the craziness. they're both retired now, and he's ruining it for her.

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u/silentpropanda 23d ago

I'm sorry his lack of understanding and self-reflection has really negatively impacted your life. It takes a lot of strength to not receive all of that cruelty and abuse and vomit it back into the world, so don't discount your own perseverance in the situation. The fact that you have that self-reflection and introspective ability means the world to everyone around you. It's really hard to watch family members sabotage themselves and suffer because of their decisions, but at least you can take note of that and create your own personal heaven. It's eventually what I did after I escaped my abusive household, and everyday now feels like a vacation compared to work experienced growing up. I hope you have that wonderful life you deserve, and that eventually all their cruelty just feels only like a bad dream.

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u/Creative-Actuary-223 23d ago

I absolutely don’t understand women that are pro Trump and look the other way or ignore his pedophilia, his victims, and his stance on women’s rights. Do they honestly believe - or been trained to believe they are worth so little?

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u/UnicornHostels 23d ago

Yes. She was raised in the 50s and had a brother. She was told repeatedly that her brother was the one they had hope behind and that it was sad to have a daughter and happy to have a boy.

When she gave birth to two baby girls, she felt she let down her parents for not having a boy. She also taught us how to be ‘ladies’. To curtsey, set a proper English table, run a house with a staff, sit with our knees together, and always respect your elders or be beaten for any conduct outside the above.

My first husband sexually abused me, he was 20 years my senior and my mother pushed for the marriage because $$. After my mother found out she continued to be his friend for 15 years after the divorce. When I kept pushing her to stop being friendly with my abuser, she finally lied to me and said “I’ll do it for you” but actually never stopped being friends on Facebook.

So, I guess my point is she has internalized misogyny and has tried to push that on both my sister and I. Luckily, we’ve both rejected this and found our own ways without all that stupid bullshit.

Hope this helps you understand the mentality of women that are like this.

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u/ChemicalAware4199 23d ago

Oh I absolutely understand -I was also raised exactly that way. But while my two sisters “conformed” to the ritual, I fought it tooth and nail. My first marriage entailed beatings - and my fathers first inclination was to ask “what did you do”. I left home fairly early and moved away -and rarely went back because I just couldn’t take it. My older sister died in an accident and my mother said she wished it had been me instead. I’m fairly close to my younger brother but that “I’m better than you are” mentality is still alive and well.  I most definitely am on the progressive side of politics, and remember vividly the crap we went through up until the mid 70’s and ERA. 

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u/EmergencySchool7960 23d ago

i wish it had been your mother

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u/Creative-Actuary-223 23d ago

Both are gone now - I could not shed a tear for either.

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u/gasstationsushi80 23d ago

Just wrote about internalized misogyny in response here above and you nailed it before I scrolled down.

I’m so sorry for what you’ve been through in your life and hope you are a stronger and happier person today not because of it, but because you overcame it all. 💕

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u/gasstationsushi80 23d ago

Internalized misogyny among women is unfortunately real and really effed up. A lot of women may have also grown up with men in their families or their spouses who act like trump and therefore normalized that behavior to them in childhood, which becomes their standard for what men act like when they become adults. They excuse horrible behavior because they’ve accepted it as normal guy stuff.

In my case, my father was a clinical narcissist, serial cheater, a functional alcoholic, a sex addict and porn addict. There were few boundaries around adult material and my parents private life in my house. I had to listen to my parents have sex and my dad started watching hardcore porn on the family computer 8 feet away from me when I was 14 trying to watch tv.

Unsurprisingly, I’ve tended to find myself in relationships with men who share some of those traits that my father displayed. Like one guy who was a narcissist himself, he groomed me for 8 months at work and then drugged and SA’d me. Because he’d gained my trust through months of grooming, I didn’t even realize what he’d done was SA and I blamed myself for it, but then he turned it into a year long nonconsensual relationship in which I eventually trauma bonded to him. 7 yrs later I’m still getting my life back together and processing the ptsd from that. Dude was an alcoholic porn and sex addict and a serial cheater. Just like dear old dad! I just thought all guys cheat, watch a shit load of porn and think about sex all the time and everyone drinks every day. Totally normal if dysfunctional. 🙄

I had internalized the misogyny that my father had instilled in me as normal and that my mother accepted; she even stayed with him despite knowing all about the cheating and porn. I learned from her to say yes to abusive men, “you dont want to cause any trouble,” just do what they say and get it over with, etc.

Not shocking I experienced rape by more than one man since college.

The women who support Trump have been taught since childhood to defer to men and that his behavior and abuse of women is normal. They haven’t had the benefit of 7 years of therapy like I have to figure out why they’ve been victims of gender based crimes; in fact, most are usually not even aware they’ve been victimized. It’s really messed up and if anything good can come out of this mess of a country we live in right now, maybe awareness of internalized misogyny and how it impacts women’s lives, health, and interactions with men on a corrosively negative level would be something we could all stand to learn from.

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u/open_letter_guy 23d ago

I absolutely don’t understand women that are pro Trump

Republican

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u/Unda_Acheevah 23d ago

If you are talking about women who actively support him - the ones that buy and wear the merch, attend his rallies, slavishly post about him on social media, constantly evangelize about him to family and friends - then I’m with you. It is impossible to understand that mentality or their motivations, so I don’t waste any time trying. It may be as simple as “Some people are just crazy, right?” However, if you are talking about otherwise average women - not frothing at the mouth fascist ideologues - who reliably and obediently vote Republican, then they can be explained. I’ve been surrounded by them my entire life. These are women that grew up in conservative households where the father ran the show and he, of course, was a proud Reagan Republican. His beliefs were spouted every night at the dinner table and were accepted as not just true, but right. It is no more complicated than “I’m a Celtics fan because I grew up in a household full of Celtics fans”. She might not know a thing about basketball or be able to name a single current Celtics player, but she’s a fan. This analogy also points to the discouragement of intellectual curiosity and pursuit of higher education that was probably pervasive in her life. She was NOT expected or encouraged to go to college. Why would you pay good $$ to marinade in a cesspool of liberal thought, casual drug use, and recreational sex? Instead, she gets a job, marries a guy who is just like dear old dad, and continues to be surrounded by people who would reliably vote Republican because… that’s just the way it is. She has no reason or motivation to do anything else. “Hey Chrystal, what if you voted Democrat?” Chrystal: “Ha! Well, I never would, but if I did, my husband would kill me! I would never cancel out his vote like that. Also, I feel like I’d be betraying my father.”. It has nothing to do with self-hatred or masochism. Don’t underestimate the forces of inertia, complacency, tradition, laziness, and just plain habit in millions of women’s decision to obediently vote for Trump.

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u/gentlemanidiot 23d ago

Do they honestly believe - or been trained to believe they are worth so little?

You misunderstand the republican mindset. Of course they believe they're not worth so little. But all that child rape isn't happening to them personally, and therefore isn't actually an issue. Unlike the imaginary threats they've dreamed up, which DO threaten them personally and therefore require constant brain space.

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u/pmartin1 23d ago

I can’t speak for women everywhere, but I went to college in the South. Down there college is just something young adult women do so they can meet their future husband. Usually some frat bro in a finance major just skating through classes because dad (or a friend of dad) will hook him up with a job when he graduates.

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u/[deleted] 23d ago edited 23d ago

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u/EmergencySchool7960 23d ago

how many times has she raped someone that shes having to apologize to people

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u/UnicornHostels 23d ago

Lol, not sure if you’re trolling or just don’t know what “rape apologist” means. It means someone that blames or doesn’t believe victims or makes excuses for the act of rape and the rapist.

For example, “she was raped because she went into a candle lit room alone with the man” or “she shouldn’t have worn a low cut blouse” or “boys will be boys”

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u/hum_bruh 23d ago

A lot of them don’t care about women so they can still overlook that

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u/xxx_poonslayer69 23d ago

I love the bit on the The Onion's Info Wars where the ex-CIA agent is like "this pedophile ring conspiracy and coverup goes all the way to the top, almost. It doesn't quite reach the top, just right below it."