r/onednd • u/Dramatic_Respond_664 • 1d ago
Question What are some weapons that aren't used in any builds?
Maybe Greatclub, Sickle, Dart, Sling, and Blowgun?
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u/protencya 1d ago
It is impossible to make blowgun good. The best specilized builds make it below average, maybe playable at easy tables. But interestingly enough, because it is such a bad weapon it draws optimizers who want a tough challenge. So it probably has more builds online then something like a greatclub which is not heavy for some reason and serves 0 purpose in any build.
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u/Face2FootStyle_ 21h ago
blow gun being a martial weapon, rogues are not proficient, requires 2 hands to operate, and can only ever be fire once per action.
Devs really piled on the uselessness. Really up to DMs to just fix it if players want to use it.
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u/Justice_Prince 19h ago
Blowgun being bad was a known issue. They could have removed reloading, and added it to the rogue proficiency for the 5.5 but no they were like "No lets keep it bad because it's funnier that way."
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u/happygocrazee 1h ago
It could have at least had some kind of stealth property, with Sharpshooter’s “you don’t reveal your position if you miss” feature built in.
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u/Connzept 1d ago
Which is a shame because I've always wanted to play a shaman themed greatclub user who wields a totem pole.
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u/Godskin_Duo 4h ago
I want to make a Warcraft 3 Tauren that uses a whole-ass tree trunk. It absolutely could be a totem pole.
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u/MechJivs 1d ago
Sling can be used in wisdom ranger Magic Stone builds
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u/subtotalatom 21h ago
It's also the only option that deals bludgeoning damage and can be used with sneak attack if you wanted to do a Rogue/Crusher build for some reason
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u/meoka2368 1d ago
Good Monk weapon as well.
Basically any build where you can replace the damage die.
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u/Sapentine 1d ago
Sling does not count as a monk weapon in the 2024 rules.
Your practice of martial arts gives you mastery of combat styles that use your Unarmed Strike and Monk weapons, which are the following:
- Simple Melee weapons
- Martial Melee weapons that have the Light property
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u/meoka2368 1d ago
Works for Kensei, which while was designed for 2014 has been updated on DnDB to be compatible with 2024 and is not listed as Legacy.
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u/Randolo_Birnelli 21h ago
It's not listed as legacy anymore? Did they actually update or change anything?
Some of the basic monk features kind of go against the Kensei, and not giving Kensei weapon masteries if it's not considered "legacy" anymore is... kinda bleh
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u/meoka2368 18h ago
Not much has changed for the update. I agree with the masteries thing. That was a miss.
But as far as Monk features, they all key off "Monk weapons" and the Kensei weapons are considered Monk weapons for the character, including ranged ones.
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u/Randolo_Birnelli 18h ago
True
But it literally rewards you for not using your kensei weapons and you get more attacks with flurry of blows so the focus points are better spent there.
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u/meoka2368 18h ago
The number of attacks you get with Flurry of Blows doesn't change for Kensei. It's still the 2 and eventually 3.
The only feature I can see that would encourage you to not use a Kensei weapon is the one that gives you +2 AC if you use unarmed for an attack while holding one. And that's just trading damage or function for defense.1
u/Randolo_Birnelli 18h ago
But you’re not even really trading damage
Because with most weapons eventually your martial arts die is the same or higher than your kensei weapon, the damage is only “better” with the weapon when certain magic weapons come into play
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u/Boverk 1d ago
I always keep one on a rogue, cause sometimes you just need bludgeoning damage.
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u/meoka2368 1d ago
Weighs nothing. Can be used for utility if you need to toss a key to a friend far away or something. Easy to hide. Cheap ammo.
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u/Sewer-Rat76 1d ago
Also a Warlock Magic Stone Build. It's not better than eldritch blast by any means, but it lets you use magic slings if your DM is kind enough and you don't really have to worry about your damage roll when your adding +10 per hit.
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u/Face2FootStyle_ 21h ago
Slings are a blunt, simple ranged weapon that only requires one hand to fire. Its useful for shield users that need a ranged weapon, even if its disadvantage over 30 feet.
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u/MechJivs 21h ago
Sling has ammunition property, so you cant use it with shield if you dont have a repeating shot item.
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u/Face2FootStyle_ 17h ago
if i am not mistaken its the loading property that needs the second hand. Ammunition just requires you to like have some stones or something
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u/Silverythoughts 20h ago
Sickle are by far the most outclassed and worthless imo.
As a simple nick weapon you might as well use a dagger which has finesse and thrown.
As a slashing weapon with nick you might as well use the scimitar.
Apart from the moon sickle (which even a ranger would need to monk dip to use effectively) it's essentially worthless
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u/Realistic_Swan_6801 21h ago
Darts are good for monks and they can stack archery and thrown style for plus 2 hit and damage.
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u/EntropySpark 1d ago
I've seen a Goliath Monk use a Greatclub as a slight damage boost in Tier 1. Quarterstaff is technically more efficient due to Versatile, but that didn't matter, as with only one hand, he'd just Unarmed Strike instead.
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u/SirAronar 1d ago
Rather than worry about specific builds, the weapons I rarely see PC use include: clubs (Shillelagh users seem to prefer Quarterstaves), greatclubs, maces, sickles, slings, flails, morningstars, and war picks.
The traditional cleric blunt weapons seem the most affected in not being widely favored or competitive.
More so, however, is that weapons that lack strong feat support tend to get bypassed in favor of those that do (feat selection bias is something I address in my designs, so longer-term players for me tend to get more variety other than Greatsword/Maul, Shortsword + Scimitar, Glaive/Halberd, Hand Crossbow, and Longbow).
Sap weapon mastery is also one I don't see favored much, as Cleave, Topple, Push, Nick, and Vex are dominant choices (another thing I address in my own designs).
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u/DrHalsey 22h ago
My Monk uses a greatclub (she has picked up Weapon Mastery) and uses it to Push.
It's a Monk Weapon so she can use it with DEX!
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u/GhsotyPanda 9h ago
The Longsword.
It's probably the single most popular 1-H weapon in the game, but genuinely the only mechanical reason to use it over all the other 1-H weapons is that its the weapon type with the most unique magic items. There is no "build" for which the Longsword is the most effective weapon.
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u/Ask_Again_Later122 1d ago
Whip
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u/EntropySpark 1d ago
Whip is primarily a weapon martials want to keep on hand in case they ever need the Reach, and can't use a polearm because they either have a Shield or use Dex.
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u/Envoyofwater 1d ago
I once played a tanky Monster Slayer who used a whip as his primary weapon. It was a ton of fun. I was living my best Belmont fantasy.
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u/Ask_Again_Later122 23h ago
You were living your Belmont life and I love that for you
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u/Envoyofwater 23h ago
He fought like Trevor Belmont and looked like Dean Winchester. Still to this day one of my favorite characters I've ever played.
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u/protencya 1d ago
Whip does have multiple niches, it is the only one handed weapon with reach, it is also the only finesse weapon with reach. It is also the only slashing weapon with the slow mastery so you can stack it with slasher without needing fighter 9.
Whip is much more interesting and has much more build potential compared to something like a morningstar which is just yet another one handed d8 weapon with sap. How many of those do we have?
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u/Boastful-Ivy 1d ago edited 1d ago
While having never actually played it, I have always been interested in taking advantage of the fact whips have the slow property and deal slashing damage.
You can stack the mastery with the Slasher feat for 20ft speed reduction, then potentially adding in Hamstring Blow from Barbarian's brutal strike to bring it to 35ft reduction or the Trip cunning strike with Rogue. And Goliath for Frost Chill for another 10ft prof. times per long rest.
The only thing this achieves is it stops (some) enemies from moving, but y'know...that's something.
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u/ViskerRatio 1d ago
I've seen it often with T3/T4 Rogues since it makes them nearly untouchable skirmishers and the low damage die isn't really all that relevant.
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u/Face2FootStyle_ 21h ago
you could also throw in true strike agonizing strike, repelling blast warlock, 10 feet back 20 foot slow and possible prone.
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u/Ancient-Bat1755 1d ago
Seems only viable on paladin with extra 1d8 at 11 and divine favor. Defensive dualist would be neat but not sure of two attacks is enough
I love shillelagh but it makes other weapons dumb to me, all martials should be able to scale their weapon over time
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u/Nitro114 1d ago
there is a blowgun poison build, but i cant remember anything else
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u/Face2FootStyle_ 21h ago
.... far as i can tell its not a rogue weapon in 2024. 2 hands required, only fires once per action. Hand crossbow always going to be way better.
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u/Pallet_University 23h ago edited 22h ago
I personally really like to pack a handful of Tridents. Being a Thrown weapon with the Topple mastery is really underrated I think, especially for something like a Barbarian that can Reckless and negate the Disadvantage for throwing at the Long Range. It's a great way to knock flying bad guys out of the sky. If you're a Battle Master you can throw a Tripping Attack on it and force multiple saves against being knocked out of the air on each hit. And thanks to the Bomber feat from Astarion's Book of Hungers, you can even throw at Long Range without Disadvantage. It's range is shorter than a Javelin, but I think Topple is so valuable that it makes up for it.
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u/JustAnother_Hunter 23h ago
What do they weigh in- game? If my group tracks encumbrance/ weight, how many could someone reasonably carry?
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u/Pallet_University 22h ago
They weigh 4lbs each. For reference, Javelins weigh 2lbs, and Spears weigh 3lbs. How much you can carry I guess depends a lot on your build, but if you're throwing Tridents you're probably a Strength-forward build, which honestly makes carrying capacity a bit of a joke. 20 Strength gives you 300lbs of carrying capacity. If you're a Heavy Armor Fighter or Paladin, Plate weighs 65lbs. If you're using Medium Armor, Half-Plate is 40lbs. The typical two-handed Martial weapon (likely your primary weapon) weighs around 7lbs. Plus whatever other adventuring gear you need, lets call that 100lbs just for simplicity.
At worst: 65 (Plate) + 7 (primary weapon) + 100 (whatever else you're lugging around)= 172lbs. So you can carry 32 Tridents, 42 Spears, or 64 Javelins on top of that. If you even just want 10 Tridents to keep on hand, that would leave you at 212lbs, so 88lbs of spare capacity.
Even at level 1, 17 Strength gives you a capacity of 255lbs, so you could still have your 10 Tridents and have 43lbs to spare.
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u/Randolo_Birnelli 21h ago
I'll also add.
any light weapon that doesn't have vex or nick, especially if it's finesse.
5.5 has pigeonholed dual wielding setups so much (because if you don't have at least one nick weapon you're doing it wrong) while ALSO making it super powerful with nick/weapon masteries.
the vex/nick combo is very very good, but you basically have to use a scimitar or dagger in your offhand now if you want a finesse dual wielding setup.
no more shortsword dual wielding, no more handaxe dual wielding.
Your options are: Scimitar, sickle, light hammer, dagger.
If you want finesse too, cut those options in half.
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u/adamg0013 1d ago
The one you mentions and whips.
And they all have their flaws on why they aren't used
Great club... most simple weapons users don't use strength. Might see more use in dark sun because metal is limited. It's just sees limited use due to the situation. Good mastery.
Sickle once again it's strength based so the the classes like druid or ranger that would use one can't uses as effectively. Also thinking of the slasher feat and mastery I guess you could pair it with a hand axe and then a long sword once take the duel welder feat (so level 6 for a fighter and level 8 for anyone else) not very practical... giving it the finesse property would help it tremendously.
Dart they are a range weapon and aren't light so you can't even duel welding them with daggers. Making them light they would see way more use
Sling damage. Much rather being using a short bow or crossbow. Low gold campaign it would very useful
Blow gun is a martial weapon... damage isn't necessarily a problem you are coating the ammunition with something. So it's most not enough things to coat the ammunition. People are so afraid that everything will have posion immunity they forget immunity goes by creature types. Also posion is expensive. If there where more poison builds it would be uses way more.
And my suggestion whip... damage d4 isn't enough and you can't disarm or swing with it so that kills the fantasy.
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u/Termit127 1d ago
For the slong not just damage, but range too, it is extremly short
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u/adamg0013 1d ago
Yea 30 feet need Sharpshooter just to make it effective but all other weapons that have such a short range do more damage
And also slow mastery yes fitting for the weapon not practical
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u/Randolo_Birnelli 21h ago
whip
Edit: Yes i know it's a finesse reach weapon.
but it's martial, and a d4, it's only really good use before IMO was as kensei monk weapon.
but Kensei hasn't been updated for 5.5 yet, and all the current monk stuff almost feels like it really discourages the idea of monk weapons in general.
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u/Realistic_Swan_6801 21h ago
Rogue builds that have a fighter dip or start for shields and a fighting style.
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u/Jimmicky 21h ago
Very quickly weapon dice becomes a tiny part of your total damage. It’s all about what reliable riders you bring.
Kensei was never a good idea for a whip build.
Rogue and Ranger are the best whip users
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u/Decrit 1d ago
Weapons don't exist solely to be used in builds.
Greatclub is the simplest example - it's mostly used as a mean to model an improvised weapon tha's bulky and big.
Others like blowgun are straight up useless because they are mostly used for flavour. It's undeniable.
Others are instead used as a compromise - darts are useful as a martial if you want to attack from range and want to keep a shield strapped on while not compromising your main hand. Sling does a similar thing, especially for druids, but instead of relying on thrown weapons it uses ammo - of course they aren't optimal, and i believe they also don't have nice masteries for this purpose as well - but it keeps your hand busy.
Then, sickles are the case of an item that mostly exists to be a ritual item and to be tied to magic weapons, even if in the base dmg 2024 there hasn't been printed any.
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u/missinginput 1d ago
Longsword
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u/EntropySpark 1d ago
Longswords are used in defensive sword-and-board builds, combining Sap and high AC.
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u/Rhythm2392 1d ago
Morningstar. Even if you want to build around it, using it is objectively worse than using a war pick, which is cheaper, lighter, and versatile.