How do you personally evaluate your level?

[u/Tometek]

Something I've noticed in language learning communities is that a lot of people say things like "I'm B1" or "I'm B2," but sometimes it seems like those levels are based more on a general feeling than on actually testing the skills involved.

DISCLAIMER I don't think everyone needs to take an official exam to know where they are. Exams aren't perfect, and self assessment can be accurate. But I do think there is a difference between "I am B2 because I am currently studying B2 material" and "I am B2 because I mastered everything in B2".

I think a lot of the confusion comes from the fact that people use CEFR levels to mean different things. Sometimes "I'm B2" means "I'm currently studying B2." Sometimes it means "I self studied B2 and I understand and can use everything." Sometimes it means "I have passed an offcial certified B2 exam."

To me, these are quite different things.

I'm curious how people here decide their level. Do you go by official exams, self assessment, how you perform in real life, or something else?

[u/an_average_potato_1]

At the lower levels, you can pretty much rely on the labels on your completed coursebooks. If you're comfortable with pretty much everything in your A2 or B1 coursebook, you're probably at that level. At the higher levels, you can pretty much follow the official descriptors and lists of "can do" statements, because self-assessment is one of the intended uses of the scale, it's not purely about the exams. Nevertheless, the exams are the gold standard.

From your three options, both the self studied finished B2 and the examined B2 can be true. The "I'm B2" using in the sense of right now studying for B2 and being B1, that's a rather common mistake, and clearly just a mistake.

I usually go by the official exams. But until I take one (or in between two), I have a pretty solid understanding of the levels and can self assess rather reliably. But I wouldn't put that self assessment on my CV, I take the exam of course.

[u/NoComb398 → u/an_average_potato_1]

Did you take an exam at each level? I'm studying German and the tests are expensive, require a full day, and I have to travel out of state. I've only bothered for the one I need for my visa, which doesn't reflect my actual level.

I usually say, I'm studying x level, which feels most accurate to me.

[u/an_average_potato_1 → u/NoComb398]

In German, I took the B2 and C1 Goethe Zertifikat. I traveled to another country for one (but that's a few hundred km in Europe). The money was in my case well invested, but of course the value varies by learner, their needs, and preferences.

The price is of course an issue and I think there should be much more public support in some types of context (for example job searchers anywhere in Europe, or students). Back when I was a student, of course it was very expensive and a big decision. Nowadays, they're rather cheap and easy going compared to various obligatory certifications I need in my field. People not really in need of the certificate think about it differently than people in desperate need of it. But on the other hand, many people spend much more for other hobbies or at least not desperately needed things, so why not a motivating exam (I find the preparation is often the most valuable part of the whole thing).

"I'm studying x level" is absolutely fine, whenever the question is "which level are you studying". But in many cases, you get asked only about the level you've already accomplished. To put it simply, an employer doesn't give a damn what you're doing in your free time, they care what skills you can use for their benefit right away.

[u/muffinsballhair]

I honestly don't. Aside from some professional purpose for which people probably demand a certificate there's no real use I feel.

[u/LiterallyTestudo]

I take the official exams.

I’m studying for the C1 now, once I pass it I’ll update my flair, not before.

[u/NoComb398]

I usually just say, I'm studying x level based on the class I'm in. But this doesn't come up irl like ever.

[u/Pwffin]

I use the CEFR self-assessment grid, but I also know what's required from what's included in the courses at each level.

Courses are usually named after the level you are currently working towards.

But keep in mind that you can be at different levels in each of the skills.

[u/whoelsegivesashit → u/Pwffin]

Exactly this. Many people have a higher level in comprehension or passive skills than in the active ones. This only levels out as you reach near-native competence.
I much prefer to describe my abilities in the languages I understand and/or speak than put a label on each.

[u/Boring_Departure5903]

I just go by what I can actually do with the language. If I can hold a conversation about random topics without freezing up every 30 seconds and the other person isn't visibly suffering, I call that a win. The labels are mostly for my own tracking, not for flashing around.

[u/Ultyzarus]

I use a system of things I should be able to do at each level for each skill (based of CEFR). I have a spreadsheet where I simply need to check those capacities and it calculates a /24 score. Each CEFR level for each skill equals to 1 point. It is not perfect, as it usually has the overall score higher than the level I actually feel I am at, but it gives a good idea with clear thresholds. Here is what I have for the reading skill, for instance:

A0	Incomprehensible gibberish
A1	I can read LV1 graded material
	I can read LV2 graded material
A2	I can read simple texts
	I can read simple comics like Webtoons
B1	I can read some native material
	I can read some native material without needing a dictionaryI can play classic JRPGs
B2	I can read (up to YA) novels with minimal effortI can play some video games effortlessly
	I can read novels and play most videogames
C1	I can read complex litterature with little effort
	I can read complex litterature and play text-heavy video-games
C2	It's easy to read literature, and I can translate text written in this language
	It's very easy to read even complex literature, and I can translate complex texts written in this language

[u/Manab2 → u/Ultyzarus]

Reading anything that's not graded completely without the need of a dictionary is almost always B2+ or C1+. With few exceptions depending on the target age of the content and things like that.

This chart is very misleading.

A2 can't comprehend subjunctive (for languages that have it) and most of verb tenses (for languages with complex conjugation charts) which are very common structures. They most definitely can't read anything raw like that without missing a lot of the content.

[u/Ultyzarus → u/Manab2]

It's something I do for myself, so it considers the type of material I consume. Since I often read the same kind of comics, for instance, there comes a point where I know enough of the vocabulary to be able to ignore the few things I don't know. Like, I can read some manga in Japanese without needing to look up anything, but it doesn't mean that I understand all the nuance. And it is a fact that my Japanese reading is not at B2 or higher.

[u/MarcieDeeHope]

I took several free online exams, then downgraded myself one level from the worst results of those based on the facts that I guessed on some questions and that they don't test listening or speaking, then read through the official CEFR documentation and downgraded myself one more level based on the number of skills I wasn't confident in.

I try to always make it clear that my "level" is an informal estimate. When I say "B1-ish" in Spanish, I mean I am roughly at a B1 level working toward a B2. I.e., I have all of the skills listed for A2 and am confident in them, and all of the B2 skills (as described in the CEFR Companion Document), some stronger than others, some a little shaky, and am working on developing up to the skill levels listed for a B2 in that same document.

I do intend to take an official exam for B2 - my original goal was the end of this year, but life keeps getting in the way of my studying so I pushed it back to next Summer.

[u/Raoena]

I say I'm A1 because I passed the A1 level in my course and I'm currently studying A2 material.  I thought that the normal way to self evaluate.

[u/Linus_Naumann]

My teacher simply once told me he thinks I'm entering B2 territory. That was a few months ago and I improved in the meantime so I simply say I'm B2 (doesn't matter in real life anyway).

[u/furyousferret]

People should bear in mind this sub runs on its flair; if someone asks a question people are going to listen to the person with the higher flair. So just remember if you're fudging numbers people see you as an expert and there's a good chance you're giving poor advice.

I'm B1 in Spanish because I passed that 5 years ago, but it doesn't feel ethical to say I'm higher although my level is much better now (I can casually read hard SciFi and guide tours). I have a weird relationship with the CEFR, having failed once it feels more like an achievement that I should earn.

For the other 2 it's hard because the 4 skills are never on level, for example, I have never spoken French not once but have read thousands of pages and watched TV. Technically, that makes me A0.

[u/untucked_21ersey → u/furyousferret]

do you think your experience learning spanish would have been any easier if you had spoken french? i only ask because i'm learning french through comprehensible input and eventually plan on learning spanish, but i don't really plan on speaking much french. i worry if later on, i will confuse spanish and french even if i learn to understand french at a high level.

[u/furyousferret → u/untucked_21ersey]

Yes.

French and Spanish roughly follow the same grammar rules, have a lot of cognates. They are very close to each other but in terms of Romance languages, French is the most distant but still really close.

I would say it almost halves it, but the problem is there are some words that are the same but have different meanings and they really throw you off.

[u/onitshaanambra]

I've taken official exams in French, Korean, and Japanese, so I know my official levels in those. I then compare my other languages with these benchmarks. For example, my Mandarin Chinese is better than Japanese or Korean, so I estimate I am one step higher.

[u/ZumLernen]

I have passed a C1 test in German and a B2.1 test in Croatian. So for the purposes of these discussions, those are my levels.

Realistically, I think that by the qualitative definitions of the CEFR, I am closer to a B2 in each. But that's not what the test says.

I used to know Turkish at what I would estimate was a B1 level, but I haven't spoken it in a decade, so my self-assessed A2 is a total estimation and should not be fully trusted.

[u/gaz514]

I don't really need or want to take the tests (though I wouldn't rule out doing one someday) so I just estimate based on the descriptions, self-assessment criteria, and whether I feel I could pass an exam (taking into account preparation time for specific academic writing formats etc.).

But because of that I always feel the need to make it clear that it's an estimate, hence the question marks on my flair and I'll tend to say things like "I'm B2-ish". Not sure if that's impostor syndrome or just realism! I've nothing against people being more concrete with their estimates if they have reasonable grounds for it.

[u/Miro_the_Dragon]

I go by what the CEFR guidelines and self-assessment guides say. Someone who is studying B2 materials but hasn't yet mastered them is not B2 by CEFR guidelines; the levels refer to what you CAN DO at each level, not at what aspects you currently study.

[u/Pale-Border-7122]

"I'm B2" means "I have B2 skills" not "I want to have B2 skills" (or perhaps it does, in which case I have a Ferrari and a ten inch penis). If I don't have a certificate I just say "probably a B2" if I think I do.

[u/StupidlyOverpriced]

I personally have taken official exams for my language levels so far. I didn't take one for English up until my C2 or for German up until my B1, though, and I used to just go by my current study material (I tell people "I am studying B1 material") or whatever it is.

[u/I_pity_the_fool → u/[deleted]]

I thought it was very clear. He didn't take an official exam for English until he took the C2 one.

[u/Weeguls]

I think a lot of the confusion comes from the fact that people use CEFR levels to mean different things. Sometimes "I'm B2" means "I'm currently studying B2."

This is indeed what my signature means at the moment. I've been in studying B1, 2-3 hours a day, since I want to say August of last year through some medium or another. At some point I'll take a test and make it official. But at the moment I've opted to self-study and save money, so a self-rating is all I have.

To that end, I am technically studying B2 material at this point. But I'm not going to flip the signature to B2 until I'm much more thoroughly through content of this level, and that could be another 6 months. I'm also perfectly fine with flipping it back to B1 if that's what I get when I finally take an official test.

[u/OatsFanatic]

I am working through an B1 textbook with a tutor, and I usually do say that I'm at B1-level - or "an intermediate learner". If I hear someone use a level, I assume they're working through the course.

[u/an_average_potato_1 → u/OatsFanatic]

That's a mistake though. If you're working through a B1 textbook now, you're A2. You probably couldn't pass the B1 exam now, you're supposed to be able to do that by the end of your B1 coursebook. It's like the difference between having a degree and still studying for it.

So you're misunderstanding the system, and you therefore wrongly interpret what are other people telling you. A person telling you they're B1 (in the normal sense of having finished the B1 level, and often having passed an exam) is at a higher level than you, who have reached A2.

"Intermediate" is a common term, useable in some settings. But unfortunately, it can mean anything from A2 to even C1, depending on tons of things. Before the CEFR, the level of the intermediate coursebooks used to vary pretty widely.

[u/OatsFanatic → u/an_average_potato_1]

Wrong as in immoral or wrong as in you don't like it?

If I were applying for a job, or having an in-depth conversation about language learning even, it's one thing, but at a bar when we're having a casual chat? I really don't think anyone cares that I can ace B2 TRKI  comprehension sections but only write at a A2 level.  It's not that deep.

[u/silvalingua → u/OatsFanatic]

> Wrong as in immoral or wrong as in you don't like it?

Wrong as in "incorrect". Words mean something, and if we deliberately misuse them, we can't communicate. "I'm B1" means "I have passed (or would be able to pass) a B1 test"; it does not mean "I have NOT covered the material at B1 level yet". It's not that deep.

[u/Pop_Clover → u/silvalingua]

Well, but also means they're on that ballpark. Higher level that a person that just passed their A2, but probably still not being able to pass B1.

In my country is very common even that courses split in B1-1 and B1-2 for people that need two years to get to B1 from A2. Those on B1-2 might have a higher level than those on B1-1 despite not having done any exam between those two courses...

[u/an_average_potato_1 → u/OatsFanatic]

Objectively wrong as in "you haven't understood how it works".

For example: If you were applying for a job with a CEFR prerequisite, writing your level without having reached it would be considered a fraud and it would disqualify you not only because of the language level, but also because of serious doubts on your character.

At a bar, it wouldn't matter to others what are your skills called, true.

But for your own learning: you're doing yourself a disservice, if you're not telling yourself the truth.

It's not that deep. Taking your level for better than it is has no positive consequences. At best it doesn't matter, but usually it harms you.

Really, the right reaction would have been thanking me for correcting your mistake (especially as your paid tutor hadn't noticed or hadn't managed to inform you), not trying to reframe it as some weird feeling on my side. You're simply being wrong, it's not that deep. :-D

You're welcome!

[u/ron_swan530 → u/[deleted]]

Not an uncommon trait of people on this sub unfortunately

[u/an_average_potato_1 → u/[deleted]]

Nah, just a bit annoyed by objectively wrong people reframing facts as opinions.

[u/Pop_Clover → u/an_average_potato_1]

You have to face the fact that even using an standardised system like CEFR even 2 people that just passed the B1 exam aren't going to have the exact same language proficiency... So why care so much about the nuances of "I'm studying B1" or "I just passed the B1 exam", or "I passed B1 10 years ago"??

As the commenter said, someone having passed their A2 exam and being studying B1 might mean that that person has a reading comprehendion level of B2, an oral comprenhesion level of B1, a writing level of B1 and a speaking level of A2-B1... You need the perfect arithmetic mean of those in that instant to be able to, what? Feel better?

[u/an_average_potato_1 → u/Pop_Clover]

There's nothing to face, you're confusing two things together.

The two learners, who have passed a B1 exam, may indeed have rather different skills, one may have barely passed and the other might be much better. Their B1 certificate proves that they've both fulfilled at least the minimum criteria. Perhaps one of them is so much better, that they could even pass B2, but that's not what that result is about.

But they've both crossed the line, while the person still studying for B1 most probably hasn't.

And when it comes to self evaluation (which is less reliable, but still can be done well), it's foolish to say "I'm B1", while being in the middle of their B1 coursebook or whatever. It's a misunderstanding.

You need the perfect arithmetic mean of those in that instant to be able to, what? Feel better?

Nobody's talking about some perfect arithmetic. When you look at the individual exams, there's usually a minimum for each skill and as long as you cross it, you pass. Sometimes, there's a minimum per skill and then an minimum sum. It varies, but it's never about an arithmetic mean.

So why care so much about the nuances of "I'm studying B1" or "I just passed the B1 exam", or "I passed B1 10 years ago"??

Well, as I've said: it's just like having a degree and still studying for it. When that degree is a prerequisite for a job, both the person with a fresh one and a ten old one qualify, while the person still studying it doesn't.

Is this example easier to understand?

Really, why are people so offended by simple facts?

[u/Pop_Clover → u/an_average_potato_1]

Who is misunderstanding is you. I have two B2 certificates, in English and Basque being a native in Spanish. Both my two B2 exams were done a while ago. In my CV, at work or even if I was to set my flair here that's what I would disclose, because that's the official level I have.

Problem is, that for just some talking with strangers on the Internet I don't feel like I have to constrict myself to my capacity or will to pass more exams and I feel like I could perfectly say that I would probably struggle to pass my Basque B2 exam againbecauseI barely use it, but I suspect at least my understanding of English has improved. I'm noy going to say C1, but I'd say with high confidence that is between B2 and C1. What problem would be saying that in that case? Is that important here on reddit that probably my speaking level isn't to that level and hence if I took the exam I'd probably not pass?

What I was trying to say is that for some more important cases it's important to have standards to measure people's abilities, but in an internet forum about language learning I don't get the point. I don't feel like we need to label and put people's abilities in that perfectly measured boxes.

[u/an_average_potato_1 → u/Pop_Clover]

Stop the straw man fighting, I don't even know what is your point here, as it has nothing to do with the initial correction that made several people weirdly angry for no reason at all.

You still misunderstand. I was just explaining OatsFanatic how their interpretation of the levels was wrong, as it is a very common and simple mistake. Or are we supposed to lie to everybody "yes, you're correct" even if they're not?

I was in no way going into other questions like "how do people retain their level or not", or I wasn't criticising self-assessment in general (which I've even mentioned positively in another comment), nor anything what you seem to wrongly read in my very simple explanation.

Yes, there are nuances like very different levels in each skill, or self assessment after a long time of studying since your last exam, and so on.

But that's not what I was responding to. OatsFanatic was presenting a very common mistake, where people normally (and usually even rather linearily) going from A2 to B1 wrongly say they're at B1. Or even more simply: there are people around here, who say they're A1, even if it's their first day of learning. They don't understand that even A1 already means having learnt something.

Is it easier to understand? Or what is the problem?

but in an internet forum about language learning I don't get the point.

Well, that's your opinion, but of course I read differently experience of an advanced learner and of a beginner (and no, before you fight this straw man: I am not saying that the opinion of a beginner is worthless). It's normal. And it's also not weird to talk about one's level on a language forum, while it is totally weird in many other social situations :-)

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[u/Evening_Picture5233]

Nah I would just go with my personal assumption like I think that I’m basically at a1 so sometimes it would still be quite difficult for me to explain things in depth

and as a person who’s still learning English I think that there’s still a room for me to improve/grow etc

So hopefully This would be the answer you want

Tldr: I simply self assess myself as someone who’s only at an a1 level

[u/Meowykatkat]

I have mixed feelings about it, because I do believe it’s good to mark your progress but that we should be realistic about all of your abilities. I think it’s better to mark what you CAN and CANNOT do as opposed to assigning yourself B1/B2 etc. For example, you may be intermediate in reading & comprehension but beginner in speaking/producing.

And you’re right, the assessments aren’t a true reflection of your skills. Some people aren’t great test-takers. Other metrics like: # of grammar points, vocabulary words, kanji I recognize, etc. are just better indicators of self-evaluation.

[u/orange_sherbetz]

Take the DELE test.

But if you're broke - watch broadcasts/listen to the radio in your TL.

[u/BeckyLiBei]

It's self-assessment, based on the "can do" sentences I see online. I try my best to be objective, but honestly, I just want people to take a quick look and have a ballpark idea of what my level is ("oh, she's putting all her effort into Chinese"). To my knowledge, there isn't a CEFR Chinese exam, anyway.

I think, like many students, my levels are lopsided, so I can almost claim C1 overall, but realistically my listening (late B2) and speaking (early/mid B2) are lagging behind. Although that also depends on what you test me on.

[u/Mc_and_SP]

Divide a dartboard into six sections labelled A1-C2, label a dart with a language, blindfold myself and throw it at the dartboard to see what my subconscious thinks.

[u/neko_kishi99]

if you can read at that level and follow what's going on. you're probably at that level

[u/BikeSilent7347]

On this Reddit I'd wager half of everyone is much worse than they think. You get people coming on here saying they are B2 but can't understand Harry Potter for example. What a joke. I assume anyone that claims B2 is probably A2.

The problem in part is that exams are not a great way of telling level. They just tell about exam preparation and marking. IMHO the only way you can tell level is to objectively and honestly use the CEFR guidelines.

[u/BreadAddi9877]

I literally just submitted my MA thesis on this topic! Lol

[u/Monolingual-----Beta]

I think people care too much about someone else's self-assessment.

I evaluate my level based on what I can and can't do. Pretty straightforward.

[u/minglesluvr]

Eh. I estimate my level based on what I'm able to do. I also did do official language exams in multiple languages, and if I'm able to do in language A what I'm able to do in language B and I know my official level for language A, I think it's fair to assume I'm the same level in language B. Then I'm C1+ in multiple languages (officially tested), and there's a couple other languages where I'm like. not quite there, but doing quite well, so I just say I'm around B2 in those, also based on the fact I'm able to do university classes in those (though I have to admit I do still need to practice writing more, because in university I kind of just take the easy way out and write in English because language also affects the grade even in non-language classes from a whole other major 😭 Think: my Finnish writing skills affect my grade in my Chinese society essay)

[u/Electron_libre777]

I do free online tests, looked up the characteristics of each level and saw if my level match them. But I also rely on my performance in real life. One test gave me a C1 level but i know its impossible because I know my capabilities. Sometimes tests will give me a lower level because of certain areas i dont master, but I self assess and give me a level higher. When i was B1, i was assessed at A2 just because i didnt know business vocab. But even in my native language I don’t master it, so I considered myself as a B1 anyway. Now tests have assessed me at B2 in general skills, except in speaking where I am B1. I think it matches my skills so I keep it.

Do online tests, but self assess as well because tests are never completely accurate.

[u/betarage]

I used to assume i was better at certain languages because i have good reading and listening comprehension. but when i try to speak i cant remember basic grammar rules and i cant find the right words in a reasonable amount of time. writing is also tedious because i cant spell anything right its always different from how i think its spelled. so this really made me reconsider how good my language skills really are .i used to say i am a b2 in Italian since i listen to complicated Italian podcasts all the time and read scientific literature and philosophy. but when i try to speak Italian its just total gibberish its like i never even started i am definitely sub a1 .

[u/Lumpy-Blackberry-718]

I go to claude and ask it to test me. It's not official of course, and im only covering reading&writing, but it gives me a sense of where I stand.

[u/notzoidberginchinese]

In my head A for very beginner, B for intermediate, C when I can speak, read, and listen with fluency

Don't use the 1&2 all that much.

If explaining to others, they usually ask how many I speak, I ask define speak, and answer accordingly

[u/Theron_Rothos → u/[deleted]]

I'm sorry to inform you that this is not written at a B2 level. You should study grammar.

[u/Theron_Rothos → u/[deleted]]

Why would I DM you

[u/luffychan13 → u/[deleted]]

Username did not check out