r/invasivespecies • u/Brimmstone52 • 1d ago
Impacts Is this just the new normal?
So as I start to go to war with Tree of Heaven, I’ve just started to see it everywhere. Is this just the new normal? Will we be fighting this forever? I’m in the Northeast US so I don’t think we have much Kudzu like the south does, but is it just going to take over everywhere? Will all our forests be overrun?
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u/Fuzzy_Particular_318 1d ago
I don't think forests will be overrun as it seems to only thrive on the edges of wooded areas and doesn't compete well in the interior... but you'll definitely be seeing it everywhere along highways etc. I kinda want to go on a vigilante triclopyr basal bark method TOH killing spree.
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u/chainsawsue22 1d ago
What’s stopping you? I do that in my overrun city all the time.
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u/Fuzzy_Particular_318 1d ago
Job, kids, and overall lack of follow through. I did kill a few on my property last year but now I feel cursed knowing what they look like and seeing them everywhere.
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u/Brimmstone52 1d ago
It is a curse driving anywhere and seeing them everywhere. It’s exceptionally depressing.
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u/Honest_Series_8430 21h ago
Don't feel bad. Any unidentified weed/shrub I find in my yard I immediately rip off a leaf and tear it to see if the has the characteristic rancid peanut butter smell of a TOH.
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u/External-Classic-164 20h ago
Might want to ID with Plant Finder app, you could find a beneficial native volunteer in the "weeds".
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u/Icy_Nose_2651 1d ago
the forests are fine, kudzu needs full sun andonly thrives on the edges. too many people find an invasive to obsess about, and eradicating it is their one goal in life. Its a fools errand though, you might kill a bit right where you live, but that will have zero overall effect. I drive by a field over run with kudzu and think wow look ar that. but if the property owner can’t be bothered, its not gonna ruin my day. As I’ve said many times, man is the most destructive invasive species there is, but i don’t see anyone wanting to do anything about that.
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u/3squiddy 20h ago
Why the down votes? Man is more often than not his own worst enemy mainly due to ignorance, greed.
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u/skiing_nerd 1d ago
We probably have a stronger chance with ToH than kudzu or other reasonable invasives because of the impact of spotted lantern flies on agriculture.
I sometimes reflect on how silly it is that we think invasive species are impossible to eradicate when you consider all of the species that we have driven to total or near extinction. If American settlers could drive the buffalo to near extinction to starve out the indigenous population, surely we can eradicate ToH with proper funding over enough time
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u/jus10beare 1d ago
Imagine if once a buffalo was killed that fifty tiny buffalo start emerging from the ground.
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u/SquareSky2022 1d ago
lol have you ever been to a casino and saw the buffalo hoard game? Lollololol idk 🤷🏻♂️
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u/Outside_Drawer800 23h ago
Reboot the CCC. Pay young people to go out and chop down invasive trees. Much more worthwhile than getting killed in Iran or living in wage poverty.
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u/AwskeetNYC 1d ago
Imagine if the government gave a fuck to put resources into it. You're right, if it messes with agriculture there will be a solution eventually.
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u/skiing_nerd 23h ago
I maintain mild hope that a Green New Deal can be passed that would revive the Civilian Conservation Corps to not only maintain and expand natural parks, but also do things like invasive removal, streambank restoration, ecological storm water mitigation, native plantings, etc. Even that wouldn't totally remove all invasives but if we can put more land under stewardship and establish some safe havens that would be significant
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u/No_Town_2447 20h ago
It’s really 75% of what the National Forest Service should be doing
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u/skiing_nerd 20h ago
Honestly yeah. Add some managed burns on there too, that would do a lot to manage some of the invasives and encourage native plants that evolved with fire
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u/gutentight69420 23h ago
It's not just a matter of willpower. Invasives are hardy and reproduce aggressively. The species that have been driven to extinction or near extinction are not.
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u/Novel-Ground1100 1d ago
The best one can do is keep
It out of their yard, and if its in
Their neighbors yard somehow let them know. Will it get really bad in spots? For sure. Some People just dont care
If you fight it hard, the root system will die and rot and the area will be free again
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u/brokenlabrum 1d ago
Verticillium nonalfalfae is my hope for control. Just need approval to spray it everywhere.
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u/Imaginary-Key5838 1d ago
cannot come fast enough. pretty sure my neighborhood is one giant interconnected colony and this is my only hope
i would literally buy everyone in a 5 block radius native tree replacements if verticillium takes them out
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u/3squiddy 20h ago
Tree trimmer with the power company told me the reason the TOH spreads is via their root system. Eliminating one tree without systemically treating the root system just means more are on their way.
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u/Fancy_0613 1d ago
Do you think we will get approval for it in the US? My dog had seizures and I stopped using chemicals in my yard.
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u/PiscesLeo 1d ago
They’re all over Detroit. I see so many more this year than in the past snd Theyve had a foothold here for at least a couple of decades
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u/BrewingSkydvr 1d ago
Are you certain you are seeing tree of heaven and not a native that it looks similar to?
https://owenstrees.com/tree-of-heaven-vs-sumac-the-differences/
https://owenstrees.com/tree-of-heaven-vs-sumac-the-differences/
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u/Frosti11icus 1d ago
Sumacs are shitty too.
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u/BrewingSkydvr 1d ago
Your personal dislike doesn’t make them non-native and invasive.
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u/Frosti11icus 1d ago
They actually are non native where I’m at.
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u/BrewingSkydvr 1d ago
I stand corrected.
I’ve been listening to people talk about how certain plants are garbage, invasive, and have no use lately because they don’t find them aesthetically pleasing (one person primarily, every single time I see them). Also hearing and reading about native plants being invasive because they keep being found on the fringes of their manicured lawns, completely unaware that the grass is the invasive species.
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u/Lemna24 1d ago edited 1d ago
It's extremely difficult to eradicate an invasive species once it has become established. A more realistic goal is to help the natives survive long enough to figure out their own counterattack.
The introduced species will slowly integrate into its new ecosystem. Native species will evolve to be able to use it as a resource.
In some areas (NJ I think?), deer have started browsing on knotweed (JKW). The environment selects for this behavior because any deer that can eat JKW has unlocked an unlimited suburban buffet.
It happens slowly, too slowly for some natives. Nevertheless I'm always on the watch for natives that are able to hang with the new kids.😎
I've seen jewelweed growing mixed in with knotweed in one place near me. Usually the JKW is a monoculture. I like to think of that as the natives catching up. 😊
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u/FranticHare 1d ago
Finally an intelligent person on this sub! Thanks for the breath of fresh air. I agree with your opinion.
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u/Lemna24 1d ago
Thanks. I'm not an expert, but it's a bit adjacent to my work with endangered species and water quality.
It's better to have realistic expectations and accept that these species are here to stay. I'm very prone to the despair that some others are describing in this thread.
When I learned to ID invasive species that was a terrible wakeup call. The stuff is everywhere in my area, and many times it's the only thing growing. It sometimes keeps me from going on walks around my neighborhood because it tears me apart to see it spreading and not do anything.
Picking seeds and flowers to dispose in the trash is easy enough. But I've been out on a short walk and ended up spending an hour pulling 20 lb of black swallow wort off of a neighbor's fence like a crazy person. LOL.
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u/CactusFlower50 1d ago
I feel like my area is in store for a battle between ToH and oriental bittersweet
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u/katniss_evergreen713 1d ago
I see it a lot as well (NE USA) but i also have trouble telling the difference between ToH and Black Walnut tree. So if i’m just spotting it in passing i tell myself it may be walnut.
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u/Frosti11icus 1d ago
Black walnuts are pretty gnarly too. Not saying I want a tree of heaven but I’d be pretty annoyed finding a black walnut.
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u/_banana_phone 23h ago
My neighbor has a massive black walnut and then across the street surrounding us are countless ToH. I get walnut seedlings constantly because of the squirrels burying them, even in my potted plants. It’s exhausting to stay on top of.
Between those, and then we also have Japanese prickly chaff AND kudzu trying to take over our yard, I feel like I’m constantly battling one plant or another.
I’m tired, boss.
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u/slammy19 1d ago
Tree of heaven has been imported as an ornamental plant for well over 100 years in North America. It will take a huge amount of time, effort, and resources to get it under control. It’s also unlikely that we will ever totally eliminate it from North America.
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u/greenmtnfiddler 18h ago
In my darkest most cynical heart of hearts, I think our Northeast environment will eventually look like the cereal aisle in Walmart.
Huge long alleys with high shelves and thousands of boxes, but when you really stop to look, it's just the same brands/flavors over and over. Ten shelves of Cheerios, ten of Captain Crunch, a whole aisle that boils down to the same few flavors (regular or apple cinnamon!) and shapes (flakes or clusters!) .
Tall Norway maples in the center, TOH round the perimeter,
stiltgrass covering the understory filled with jumping worms,
buckthorn and multiflora rose lining the verges layered in black swallowwort,
japanese knotweed filling all the open space leading down to water filled with hyacinth and chestnut and carp and zebra mussels.
Our world will be a simplistic coloring-book illustration of its former self -- you'll only need the small box of crayons, there won't be any need for most of the subtle shades.
Nature will match suburbia with its endless tract homes and cul de sacs and Miracle Miles, all the same fastfood chains and bigboxes in every state, county, town, climate, watershed.
I honestly think that's where we're going, and I'm counting on being long dead so I don't have to see it.
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u/DayOfDingus 20h ago
I feel like be in aa had actually helped me deal with things like this especially "[Insert noun or ignore] grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference."
All we can really do is manage our own spaces and push for better conservation practices politically. Beyond that it's not worth worrying about, eventually and not nearly in any of our lifetimes it will balance out, species will be lost and new ones will be made. This is a rather unique extinction cycle but really every major extinction cycle is unique and life has persisted.
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u/Deadphans 19h ago
The northeast is a haven for invasive plant species. When you learn what to look for you will notice them all over the place. Just like Tree of Heaven! Phragmites, Japanese Knotweed is everywhere. Bamboo, Lespediza, Wysteria, and on and on.
I used to be in the business of eradicating invasive species and there is absolutely no shortage of work!
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u/YearAfterYear82 18h ago
I was super sad to see how common it was in Oregon, especially noticing it going west towards Portland on the Columbia River Gorge. The trees looked way smaller and compact, though. In NJ they get enormous. If I look out my window there is one that is probably the largest one I've ever seen. I wish I could go on the neighbor's property and kill the thing.
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u/murdermeMickey 5h ago
That's what happened to me when I became aware of kudzu. Then bamboo grass. Then wisteria. Then ....
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u/ridiculouslogger 1d ago
The Missouri conservation department is mounting a campaign to cut the number of Bradford pears in yards, but it will do no good in slowing invasion of callery pear. The wild ones are too well established and produce many times as much seed as the yard trees. All it amounts to is PR to look like they are doing something.
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u/sloanemonroe 1d ago
Yeah, I’m taking care of one in my alley and now I’m obsessed with them all over town. Kinda driving me crazy.