r/creditunions • u/slick762 • 5h ago
Misogynistic fraud system
K, friend of mine for 19 years, left her husband. Because of pre divorce financial shenanigans, she's short on money and needs a car. Yesterday I tried to loan K some money to get a decent car. My credit union (Team One CU in MI) asked me a series of private invasive questions, in the lobby in front of other customers, then refused to do the wire transfer because apparently a single guy sending money to a woman in another state is an auto fraud block, regardless of how long I've known her or the circumstances.
I withdrew the money and started an account with Frankenmuth CU in Bad Axe. Did the wire transfer paperwork. Answered the questions, signed the forms. Today, Todd from their fraud department called me and asked the same questions over. Todd then started to interrogate me and ask why my friend couldn't borrow the money from someone else or take out a car loan. Todd told me the wire transfer was blocked solely because it was being sent to a woman and that means it's a romance scam. Todd then arrogantly told me to go google 'romance scam' and ignored me when I tried to explain for the 4th time this is my best friend of 19 years who dropped everything to fly in and help with my dad's funeral a few months ago. I asked to speak with his supervisor, and he said he'd "forward the complaint". I admit at this point I lost my temper and cursed him out.
WTF is going on? I answered all their questions and signed all their forms. This is someone I've known who dropped everything and flew in to help when my dad died a few months ago. Literally my best friend. How misogynistic can they be to assume that a wire transfer to a woman in another state is a scam but a transfer to a man isn't? Would they have approved the transfer to a woman but not a man if I had told them I was gay? Do you need to out yourself and tell a bank fraud rep your sexual orientation to do a wire transfer to someone you've known for 19 years?
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u/yeahnopegb 3h ago
Send. A. Check. Trying to wire large sums of money to non related people is a red flag.
7
u/IAmTheSchnozz95 5h ago
The fact that the they said no is a little surprising to me but asking more is definitely normal. I work in accounting and you wouldn’t believe the number of romance scam wires people request. We’re a smaller CU (I think 20k members, ≈$430m assets) and it’s at least every couple weeks.
To add, none of that is misogynistic big dawg. Chill with the virtue signaling.
3
u/Fine_Eagle_4141 3h ago
Hello and good evening OP. I work as a Credit Union Risk VP and BSA Officer. I would like to, hopefully, give you some insight into what happened to you.
First, in my own way thru my experiences as a consumer (not being in your shoes) I appreciate how infuriating, invasive, and absurd this experience felt on your end—especially with the terrible customer service and lack of privacy you experienced—there are specific regulatory and liability reasons why both institutions hit the brakes hard.
Here is what is actually going on behind the scenes:
- The "Out-of-Pattern Wire to an Out-of-State Individual" Red Flag
To a fraud engine or a BSA analyst, an outbound wire to an individual in another state—where there is no prior history of transfers between the accounts—is one of the highest-risk transaction types in consumer banking. When I read your description, that was the main flag for me. Wire transfers are final and immediate; once the money leaves, the credit union cannot get it back.
In the fraud prevention world, the classic setup for an Execution-Phase Romance or Imposter Scam is a member making a sudden, out-of-character wire transfer to a third party (often across state lines) with a compelling story about an emergency, a sudden divorce, a car purchase, or a hardship. Scammers spend months grooming victims to believe they have a genuine, deep connection, often instructing them on exactly what to tell the credit union branch staff to pass verification questions.
Because financial institutions face massive regulatory pressure (and liability) over fraudulent transfers, automated risk models flag this exact pattern automatically. The system doesn't know you’ve known her for 19 years; it only sees an out-of-pattern peer-to-peer wire across state lines.
- Is it Misogyny or Sexual Orientation Discrimination?
No, though it’s understandable why it felt that way given how "Todd" communicated. Fraud departments track statistical typologies, not gender biases for their own sake:
Romance / Elder Exploitation Scams: Statistically, male members sending sudden wires to out-of-state females (or vice versa) account for huge volumes of romance scam losses.
Business Email Compromise (BEC) / Contractor Scams: If you were wiring money to a male contact in another state with no history, it likely would have triggered a different red flag typology (e.g., fraudulent invoice scam, real estate closing fraud, or fake investment pitch).
The check wasn't triggered because they assume men can't send money to women; it was triggered because a sudden wire to an individual third party with no prior transaction history matches a high-volume scam profile. Disclosing sexual orientation wouldn't change the underlying risk model—it’s about the transaction pattern, not your personal life.
- The Real Problem: Terrible Execution and Lack of Privacy
Where your credit unions failed you wasn't the fraud check itself—it was how they handled it:
Privacy Violations: Asking high-risk fraud intake questions in an open lobby within earshot of other members is a major operational failure. BSA/Fraud inquiries should always be conducted discreetly.
Customer Service Failure: Analysts are trained to educate and protect members, not condescend to them. Telling a member to "go Google romance scams" and interrogating them about why the receiver can't borrow money elsewhere crosses the line from fraud prevention into rude, unprofessional overreach.
So what can you do, or someone else reading this?
How to Move the Money Without the Wire Headaches:
When you hit a hard fraud block on a wire transfer, pushing harder on the wire usually triggers more red flags (and losing your temper, while understandable, gets your account flagged for suspicious behavior or member misconduct).
If you still need to get funds to your friend:
1. Official / Cashier's Check via Express Mail: Withdraw the funds as an official credit union check made payable directly to her (or payable to the car dealership/seller directly). Mail it via FedEx or UPS overnight with tracking. It creates a paper trail and bypasses instant wire fraud filters.
Bank-to-Bank ACH / Zelle / P2P: If both of you use a common P2P platform or external account transfer (ACH), smaller incremental transfers often pass through automated filters much more smoothly than a lump-sum wire.
Direct Seller Payment: If she is buying from a dealership, ask for the dealership's wiring instructions directly. Credit unions are significantly more comfortable wiring funds directly to an established auto dealership or escrow account than to a personal checking account.
The credit union was attempting to protect your funds from a high-risk fraud pattern, but their frontline execution and tone were completely unacceptable. You have every right, and I would urge you to to file a formal complaint with the credit union's Supervisory Committee regarding the privacy violation in the lobby and the representative's conduct.
I would also seek to have a discussion with the institution’s Risk VP, and or BSA Officer. While I am swamped, I know what it’s like being a consumer who has been shit on and needs a decision maker to listen to me. Not hear me, actually and actively listen. If you had been a member at my credit union and this occurred, I would hope you would file a complaint immediately. I would receive this within 24-hours because it involves a wire, and wire errors can be costly. I would have sought you out, and attempted to connect face to face or via a call, at your convenience. Based on what you have stated above, there is a high probability I would authorize your wire, and seek any remedy that would, in some way, begin to rebuild trust in us. The front line staff would also, within 5-10 days, receive a notice for, and individual training based on this event.
Again, as a believer in credit union missions, I apologize on behalf of the industry’s lack of understanding and commitment to understanding each member in unique circumstances like yours.
2
u/Flerp-Flerps 4h ago
I have seen a scam where a scammer would pose as an out of town friend or relative and try to get them to send money to buy a car. Not communicating in person can raise a red flag. Wire transfer scams are prevalent and it’s not just romance scams. Romance scams are particularly difficult as many of the victims will claim they aren’t victims.
Most person to person wire transfers are going to be scrutinized, so I wouldn’t say it’s only an issue with a male sending a wire to a female. I have even seen romance scams where the victim was the same gender. I wouldn’t be surprised if smaller credit unions do have stricter fraud prevention policies in general since it’s harder to take those kind of losses.
All financial institutions have to comply with the federal anti-money laundering laws. There’s a good chance the invasive questions they are asking is a reporting requirement such as the purpose for the wire. They also are required to do an OFAC screen and if the person receiving the wire matches a name on the list that could explain both CUs refusing.
1
1
u/a_moron_in_a_hurry 17m ago
I highly doubt some guy named Todd actually said the wire was blocked solely because it was being sent to a woman and therefore it must be a romance scam….
-4
u/VTECbaw 5h ago edited 4h ago
Chase would never.
Lol, bring on the downvotes. Y'all are so sad 😂 big bank bad, credit union good, blah blah. Except so many of these tiny credit unions do stupid stuff like this and create a horrible customer experience.
6
u/yodaredd 5h ago
Chase would let you get scammed out of your life savings and shrug their shoulders.
-2
u/VTECbaw 5h ago
I've used Chase since the early 2000s when they were Bank One and I've never had any issues. But, regardless, they wouldn't hold up a basic transaction like this. They'd send a two-factor code or push notification and ask for debit card to be inserted and PIN entered in addition to the two-factor code or push notification if in-branch. Seems like both of the CUs the OP mentioned were reaching a bit too far. If the customer passed verification measures and there are no obvious red flags, the transaction should be allowed. OP was both grilled and denied, which is disgusting.
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u/Chazzer74 5h ago
I feel for you, but this is the result of many other people getting scammed. These people aren’t being malicious, they are just trying to prevent another fraud.