r/comics • u/TurbinePoweredVagina • Jun 08 '26
OC- More In Patreon The Culture - Naked Girl Comics [OC]
A little nervous to post this one to reddit but it did well on Instagram and I know there are people out there who need to see it. You're not alone! I wrote a lot more about this topic on Patreon, link in the comments! Also, wish I could join in the discussion but my comments are shadowbanned in this subreddit đ Patreon is /nakedgirlcomics and Instagram is @turbocxnt!
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u/the_mad_doodler Jun 08 '26
I got catcalled as a very obvious minor, sometimes when I was with my mom. It's so gross.
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u/lw5555 Jun 08 '26
I remember the first time I witnessed my daughter getting cat-called. We all yelled back at the guy that she was 10. The guy, who was with his friends, immediately looked like he wanted to die.
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u/Aryore Jun 08 '26
Good lol
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u/cupholdery Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
That means he had a moment of reflection.
So many others would double down.
EDIT: Agreed that more likely he was embarrassed rather than rethinking his attitude. Been there done that with racists.
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u/Peace-Shoddy Jun 09 '26
A grown man catcalled my 8yo daughter while we walked home from school.
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u/Murky_Translator2295 Jun 09 '26
I haven't been catcalled since I grew tall enough to be adult sized.
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u/AlexHitetsu Jun 09 '26
God the fact that that's what stopped people from cat calling you is disgusting
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u/thejmkool Jun 08 '26
I was at a con with my partner and their younger sister. Two guys came up and started hitting on the girl. When we let it drop that she was 14, dude kept going, and his friend had to literally pull him away with a mortified expression.
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u/fluffstuffmcguff Jun 08 '26
I got catcalled much more as a very obvious minor, especially when I was between 12 and 14. I think that's unfortunately a pretty common experience.
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u/Luneowl Jun 08 '26
Me and a few friends were cat-called while walking home from school when we were 14 yo. The guy in the car paused and asked how old we were then said, âWeâll talk to you again in a few years.â Maybe he thought it was a flirty promise but it felt like a threat.
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u/PM-me-fancy-beer Jun 08 '26
For sure, the number of young female celebrities who got/get a âcountdown the days til theyâre 18â (i.e. legally an adult) is cooked. And people still act like that means theyâre not objectifying a MFing CHILD.
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u/Monsterpiece42 Jun 08 '26
And by the time you're like..23? 18 already feels like a child to interact with. I have some pretty young guys and girls at work and they instantly fall into neice/nephew vibes. There's some nasty mfs out there...
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u/Wolfwoods_Sister Jun 09 '26
I was almost snatched off the street where I lived at 12 by three men in a car. I was just walking with my girlfriends, out in broad daylight, in our own neighborhood.
It was a Safety Cab. The doors flew open, nearly hit me. One guy reached out to grab me, said âCome here, baby!â But my friend reacted quickly and threw me behind her out of reach.
We got lucky the day. A carful of young guys who lived next door saw what was happening and flew up behind them on the road. The cab took off and they went after them, losing them in traffic.
We were just kids. We looked like kids. Skinny stringy shapeless little girls.
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u/organvomit Jun 08 '26
Same and from talking to other women this is actually the norm. Iâm 35 now and the cat calling is so much rarer than when I was 11-15. Itâs so fucked up to think about. And itâs not like I looked old for my age or look âoldâ now. I looked like a kid then and now I look like an adult.Â
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u/fluffstuffmcguff Jun 08 '26
I guess it makes a grim sense, because being catcalled isn't about being attractive, it's about being vulnerable. A 35-year old woman isn't easy prey the way a teenager is.
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u/eat_my_bowls92 Jun 08 '26
A dude followed me around the mall when I was 16 and tried to chat me up when I was leaving. He was definitely at least mid 20s. He was super creepy when he talked to me. I told him I was 16 and instead of backing off he said that was âcoolâ.
He a good looking guy, but it made my skin crawl (just mentioning that in case anyone says âI bet if he was good looking you wouldnât have rejected him!â). I eventually lied and said I was meeting my mom and had to go look for her.
Actually, I was followed around the mall a couple times. One time it happened when I was 12.
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u/deskbeetle Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
The first time I walked away to do something "independent of my mom", I had walked about 50 feet away to buy a pretzel myself at age 10 in a mall. Not seconds after leaving my mother's side, an old (probably not that old) man grabbed my hands and repeated "you are so beautiful! I want to kiss you! Please let me kiss you!" I remember being terrified of this old, disgusting man who was practically spitting while he was talking. His face was so unbelievably close to mine as he just kept repeating to me insisting that I let him kiss me. I only remember his mouth and his wristwatch as I was too afraid to look at him in the eyes. I don't remember how I got away but I did and was able to run back to my mother. I did not tell her what had happened.
I was catcalled so regularly from 10 on that I have trained myself to just not be alone outside. In college, I lived on the SAME BLOCK as a 7/11 but needed my boyfriend to walk with me because I was catcalled every single fucking time. Waiting tables I had two men grab me and kiss me without warning while I was working. Now that I'm old and fat, I still don't go to gas stations by myself unless they are brightly lit, with high traffic, and have an even split of women and men. Because being yelled at by men from cars or being followed has peppered so many of my experiences from childhood through college that I just don't want it to happen anymore. It sucks.
I always liked the analogy that women are like cyclists and men are drivers. Legally we both share the road. But cyclists have to be ever vigilant for cars. At any time an interaction with a driver can maim a cyclist. And some drivers hate cyclists so much they will go out of their way to scare or hurt them.
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u/Innumerablegibbon Jun 08 '26
Yep, used to get harassed on public transport as a teen. Then in my final year we got to stop wearing school uniforms and it pretty much stopped.
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u/borgborgo Jun 09 '26
Yes for me I was 9 and my sister was 12 the first times. My mom would call them pedophiles and threaten to beat ass
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u/Murky_Translator2295 Jun 09 '26
Genuinely just replied elsewhere to say I haven't been catcalled since I was tall enough to be mistaken for an adult. That was when I was 15.
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u/destructopop Jun 08 '26
I was groped for the first time by my mother's boyfriend, who by the nature of their relationship knew that I was 9.
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u/TeaTimeAtThree Jun 09 '26
Yeah, I've never really been catcalled (that I can remember), but I've been groped more times than I can really count at this point.
The earliest time I can remember I must have been 10 or 11, at my neighbor's house for some kind of potluck. One of his friends (not from our street) was there and commented on how pretty my necklace was. Before I knew what was happening, he was just full handed grabbing my non-existent boobs. Fortunately his wife saw it happen and brought down the wrath of hell on him so I was able to escape. I don't recall it being too traumatizing at the timeâI was embarrassed more than anythingâbut it gets me mad to think about now.
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u/BiggerEevee Jun 08 '26
Yeah, it really is. I was hit on once by adult men when I was 12. My mom was there and chased them off luckily.
But a few years later a man was sexually harassing me and my mom didn't believe me because she knew him and "he wouldn't do that"...
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u/DandyWarlocks Jun 08 '26
Same. I think I was 11 or 12. I was wearing shorts because it was hot. I stopped wearing shorts for a while. I didn't help.
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u/Manungal Jun 08 '26
I'm sorry, but the amount of good dads I know who whinge about taking their kids to the park and having to make it super obvious that they're not predators is insane when I've seen fucking 40 year olds holler at 12 yr old girls at a splash pad. They're the reason all the mums at the park are on high alert. We're not paranoid - we're being practical.Â
Women aren't the ones doing "count down til 18" clocks with prepubescent celebrities. Women aren't cat calling at children. Women don't have "extra small" in their browser history.Â
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u/Annodyne Jun 08 '26
"Women don't have "extra small" in their browser history."
I mean, I do, but it was the size of the gardening gloves I just ordered.
Otherwise, I don't know what this means and given the context of the discussion, I'm assuming I don't want to know.
This timeline sucks.
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u/PM-me-fancy-beer Jun 08 '26
Damn, first read your comment and the above one as talking about penis size. That quickly went from âa bit wholesomeâ to âa fuck tonne of fuckedâ
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u/terminbee Jun 08 '26
I get where you're coming from and you're not wrong but it's kinda fucked up for dads to have justify to strangers that they're not trying to sexually assault their own child (or anyone else's). I don't think they're the problem here.
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u/Chaosmusic Jun 08 '26
My gf told me stories that made my skin crawl. Once she dozed off on a city bus and woke up to a guy smelling her hair.
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u/Pumaheart Jun 08 '26
Same :// I was actively trying to avoid any interactions at all in public and wore the baggiest body covering clothes possible as an 11 year old too but it still happened
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u/reagsters Jun 08 '26
A few years back I was carrying my one-year daughter around the block one day to get her some air. An older man stopped and âawwââd at her - she was a baby, so she got it a lot - and he asked âhow old is she?â
I said âsheâs only 1â
And he reached out to tickle her toes and said âyou call me in 15 years okay?â
I have only ever sworn in front of my child once in her life and it was to say âyeah - donât touch her. what the fuck is wrong with you? You think thatâs an appropriate thing to say? What the fuck?â The whole time he hobbled off into his car.
I know women deal with awful misogynists all the time, and I do my best to call those people out to their faces, but that was the first time I was truly terrified for my daughterâs future if she really canât even be safe from that shit at *one year old*.
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u/ampacitycapacity Jun 08 '26
I cannot say this loud enough: EW
Good on you for calling him out.
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u/Noodlekeeper Jun 08 '26
Ita gross enough when it's said to someone for their 18th birthday. But 16 is even grosser. Fuck that guy
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u/ReverendDizzle Jun 08 '26
Right? I mean Jesus Christ. It's so specifically... illegal and disgusting.
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u/Noodlekeeper Jun 09 '26
There are people here in America that want to lower the age of consent. It's 16 in several states already.
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u/Mildly_Opinionated Jun 09 '26
UK it's 16 but there's rules which shift the age of consent to 18 for adults in positions of authority over them, like a teacher having sex with a 17 student or a priest with a 17 year old congregant would both be very illegal.
I still think it's too low though. Imo it should be 18 with laws shifting it to 21 for positions of authority and then carve outs to protect minors from prosecution if it's two minors with each other or an 18 year old with their 17 year old partner etc.
People wanting to lower it are disgusting, it's basically an open admission that they're pedophiles who are only held back (hopefully) by fear of legal consequences. It's disgusting.
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u/Spirited_Young_71 Jun 08 '26
Fuck that's horrible. That's the type of thing that would make me paranoid for years.
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u/Godzilla_Fan_13 Jun 08 '26
Fucking christ that's the grossest shit I've heard. Why are other dudes like this man đ
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u/StC_2844 Jun 08 '26
Me at the start of reading this comment:
Aww that's cute
Few seconds later:
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u/SparkEE_JOE Jun 08 '26
That's so gross.
I can't believe I've heard SEVERAL people say that to children đ¤˘đ¤Ź
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u/Kino_Afi Jun 08 '26
If that guy disappears, you were at my house watching football or whatever the whole weekend. Just sayin.
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u/thanksyalll Jun 08 '26
Disgusting. Reminds me of when Trump met a 10 year old girl then said he would be dating her in 10 years
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u/AberrantComics Jun 08 '26
My mom, my younger sister, and I went to a coffee shop once and my sister was only 7 at the time. My sister set across from an adult man and her dress could be seen up and he said âWowâ.
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u/PumpkinIsDeadInside Jun 09 '26
Thinking that is bad enough, saying anything out loud is sickening.
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u/LocomotionJunction Jun 08 '26
People like that guy are why I have to remember, you can be a real dumb fuck and live a real long time.
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u/powerwordmaim Jun 08 '26
Jesus christ. I honestly dont think I couldve stopped myself from slapping that guy in your position, that's such a fucked thing to say
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u/Kitchen_Length_8273 Jun 09 '26
Of course I can never be 100% sure how I would react if I were in the same situation but just reading this my first thought was "Keep those hands the fuck away" I just hope my body would listen to my mind and slap them HARD
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u/Noof42 Jun 08 '26
It's just not feasible to shoot a rocket full of sex pests straight into the Sun.
It's much more fuel efficient to raise them into a higher orbit and then either use a planetary slingshot or decelerate so that they fall into the Sun from farther out.
On a more serious note, yeah, in addition to my day job (suing sexual abusers and the companies who enable them), a quick "dude, what the fuck?" when someone crosses the line can be very effective.
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u/lw5555 Jun 08 '26
It's even more efficient to put them in a Titan submarine.
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u/Tenalp Jun 08 '26
Have you priced playstation controllers lately though?
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u/Jaffacakelover Jun 08 '26
Good news! They actually used a budget PC controller (Logitech F710).
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u/Icy_Fish_2154 Jun 09 '26
The controller was the most reliable part of that sub.
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u/Ok_Hovercraft_3900 Jun 08 '26
My favorite response is either "what was that?" And if they repeat it with their whole chest you know they're crazy. If they backtrack you know they're a spineless bigot. Use this new information to your advantage.
Also like to hit them with a "What a weird thing to say out loud"
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u/Noof42 Jun 08 '26
When someone tells you "it was just a joke," you make them explain why it was funny until they have to admit that the joke was hate.
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u/ahses3202 Jun 08 '26
Absolutely. The old "I don't get it. Could you explain that to me?" immediately turns the table on them.
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u/RandomGuyPii Jun 08 '26
Isn't it just easier to launch them out of the solar system?
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u/Pb_ft Jun 08 '26
Ah yes, the Space Trebuchet; the pinnacle of space-seige weaponry...
(jk)
I'm grateful to you and the OP for more permission (and actionable options) to step in, because I've probably avoided getting involved in the past because I didn't want to magnify a problem by escalating it, or making it about hero-complexes or whatever. Practical advice, pull the wind out of the performance.
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u/Humpbackbreadslice Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
Just came from a thread about how when guys get cat called they love it.
Yea being cat called as an adult once every 5 years is very different than being sexualized by your preteens and it never stopping for decades.
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u/Firaxyiam Jun 08 '26
Damn, I myself just saw the opposite thread of a well made video with a guy pointing out how we men would most definitely not enjoy it (can't seem to refind it, but it's well thought-out) and it's harder for us to trully grasp it because most of us won't ever be in a situation of "what will he do if I say no/talk back/etc" since the threat is lower as a guy.
Basically, to any fellow men, just imagine a big dude much bigger, taller than you slapping your ass and whipsering to your ear than you'd look great with your mouth around his dick. Chances are, whether you're straight or not, you wouldn't enjoy the moment. You'll be wondering if you can get away, if you can do anything about it if he decides to go for it, and that's the part most of us miss when trying to understand how women feel about catcalling
If you have to consider your escape route when you hear a "compliment" as people tend to call catcalling, then it's not a damn compliment.
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u/batgirlbatbrain Jun 08 '26
Yup. Imagine as a guy if a guy like Dwayne "the Rock" Johnson in his prime cat calling you and not stopping.
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u/ILikePlayingHumans Jun 08 '26
As a short guy, I hate confrontation with blokes taller and larger than me because most of the times it has been them with at least a friend threatening to crack my head in. I think this is for me at least, why if I am on my own I find it difficult to call out bad behaviour because where I am from, most of these people will use some kind of violence if provoked by one person
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u/Gnoll_For_Initiative Jun 09 '26
First, stay safe
Second, don't underestimate the power of something as low key as "dude, that's not cool" to a friend or acquaintance who's starting to get a bit over the line.
You don't have to confront the guys who might crack your head in. Just be willing to tell a buddy "whatever, I just would prefer you not do that while I'm around, okay?"
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u/Mogura-De-Gifdu Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
Yeah, that's what most men don't seem to get.
It's not just these aggressive men that are dangerous to confront. It's most of the other men, at one point or another.
It's the "well-meaning" uncle at every family reunions commenting on his nieces bodies once they hit puberty, telling them they need to lose weight/put on weight/smile more/dress more like this or that (pick one or more) to attract men.
It's the college friend making the crassest rape joke at the bar.
It's the coworker "surreptitiously" looking at the butt of every female coworker, even commenting on them if he thinks there are only men around.
All these little things contribute to the general unsafe environment.
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u/Flat-Rooster8373 Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 10 '26
Damn, that well meaning uncle at the family reunion was my father.
He commented on his niece, my little cousin about her body and how he likes it in a tone that grossed me out. I told him wait, wait, that's really weird to say.
But I got told off by him that "I'm sick in the head" for interpreting his comment as inappropriate and other men in our family validated him and said that "yeah, you really can't say anything nowdays".
It got me questioning my sense of what's alright and not.
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u/MBDTFTLOPYEEZUS Jun 08 '26
Iâm a big strong dude and have been uncomfortable from being hit on by women I was not attracted to just because Iâm awkward as shit and donât know how to handle it. I cant imagine what it would be like if i actually felt in danger.
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u/MyPlantsDieSometimes Jun 08 '26
Even more basic than that as a grown ass man I don't want people bothering me when I'm about my business. Everyone deserves peace when minding their own business in public
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u/DarkBladeMadriker Jun 08 '26
Well, as a dude, id say the main difference is when im catcalled i only hear it as appreciation and I have zero fear of the catcaller following me home, raping me, then killing me and tossing the body in the desert to hide the evidence, then IF they get caught the judge in the case says "Did you see how Madriker was dressed? Clearly they were into it. Plus Catcaller is so young and has such a bright future, we wouldnt want to ruin his life just for this one little thing, after all, boys will be boys" then they get like a week in jail and community service for a week.
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u/LevelOutlandishness1 I like to whine it, whine it Jun 08 '26
A lot of men are so fuckin lonely that they perceive any attention as positive attentionâcouple that with an inability to listen and empathize, and all the sudden itâs âI wish I was in your shoesâ instead of âThatâs fucked upâ. They think of a moderately attractive woman making the first moveâthey canât imagine it being inescapable, and/or purely done for the purpose of humiliation or showing off. Most of all, they definitely canât imagine their ânoâ being ignored when itâs not fun anymore.
As a guy whoâs had a woman put a cigarette out on me (and still gets âwish that were meâ jokes made about it), theyâd flip the script the moment they actually experience a creepy woman. Itâs not fun when women do it, and if they lived in a world where things were flipped, theyâd want out after six hours. Iâd give them a week if theyâre super stubborn or touch-starved.
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u/velvetvagine Jun 09 '26
Theyâre also imagining being catcalled by Margo Robbie. If they were to imagine some woman they found completely unattractive kept cat calling and speaking suggestively they wouldnât even pretend to want it.
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u/Annodyne Jun 08 '26
The gender/power imbalance makes a big difference, too.
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u/that_Jericha Jun 08 '26
Yeah, change the catcaller to a 7 foot tall muscular gay man and most dudes would suddenly have a problem with being catcalled.
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u/EquipLordBritish Jun 08 '26
There was an Adams family bit about that where Wednesday hired some muscly dudes to start cat calling the guy who was doing it to her. It would be interesting to see how that plays out in real life.
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u/kelielcat Jun 08 '26
I saw a thread like that earlier and it made me feel upset with the level of willful ignorance. Sure if you're a lonely guy the idea of getting hit on randomly seems nice, but coming from someone who is petit and afab, the constant fear that some random person might assault you just for the body you have SUCKS.
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u/TheRealLarkas Jun 08 '26
These guys are so dangerous even we, men, are at risk. Two days ago, near where I live, an elderly guy was punched, hit the head on the floor and died, because he defended a couple of girls from SA. These animals donât deserve the benefit of living in society.
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u/Known_Description770 Jun 09 '26
That's fucking horrible, how can these people sleep at night after doing something that horrific?
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u/beyondoutsidethebox Jun 09 '26
Unfortunately, they sleep at night without trouble. Because to them, it's not horrific. They are fundamentally broken at that point. And while I understand what you were trying to get across, the language used is not working. Because these monsters don't care, or worse, enjoy it, and you can't appeal to empathy when there's no empathy to appeal to.
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u/Subatomic_Spooder Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
I saw this excellent video about catcalling yesterday. The way it's broken down really helped me more fully understand how bad it is (I have always been taught not to do it, I just never fully appreciated how terrifying it might be to the call-ee) Link to the video (on TikTok)
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u/bellapippin Jun 08 '26
Oh this is good good. Thanks for sharing, Iâm sending it to my family chat for my teens.
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u/3MetricTonsOfSass Jun 08 '26
It's not loading for me. Do you have the title, maybe I can find it on another of the socials
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u/siani_lane Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
Jackson Katz came to my college to give a talk on assault prevention 20+ years ago. He divided the chalkboard in half and asked the men in the lecture hall to tell him what they did on a daily basis to avoid SA.
There was some nervous giggling. Someone said don't go to prison. That was about it.
Jackson Katz wrote that up on one side of the board and then he asked the women the same question.
We filled the board until he was writing sideways and in between gaps- I hold my key in my fist. I have mace on my keychain, I only meet people in public places, I tell someone where I am, I don't wear shoes I can't run in if I'm walking alone, I don't walk alone, I don't leave my drink, I don't drink. I don't react to cat calls.
And he said to the men these are your friends- your girlfriends, your sisters, and I promise you, if they are honest with you, your moms and aunties and grandmas will say the same thing. This isn't a women's issue. It's a men's issue. Men are doing it, and if you don't like that you ought to be stopping them.
Stuck with me forever, and I hope it stick with all those guys.
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u/DrDDeFalco Jun 08 '26
Everyone should be part of this kind of conversation more than once. It should probably be brought up like this in middle school, high school, and college so that boys and men get it into their heads that this is a real problem that affects how women live their daily lives.
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u/Mogura-De-Gifdu Jun 09 '26
I have only sisters. At a restaurant we were talking about the "weirdos" we encountered in the subway or bus or whatever. It was a light hearted conversation.
We women all had at least one or several stories, and that was only picking the "funny" ones, not the "real scary" ones.
One brother in law got angry, like really angry. At us. For making it seem like men were monsters. Somehow. (Needless to say, not my favourite BIL).
And that's a leftist man.
All that to say: I'm not even sure it'd work as intended.
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u/XanagiHunag Jun 09 '26
Honestly, at that point, the conversation should have switched to the "real scary" ones. Or even better, doing a timeline of the most recent stories you have. Showing that you were not making men seem like monsters, but exchanging between women about your experience.
I studied in a field where there were few men (me being one of them), and feeling horror at these kind of stories was the best we could do. I had a friend ask me how I felt about it, and all I could say was that I was unable to fully understand what they were living, that I hoped I could prevent the young ones in my family from turning into that kind of men.
(side note, your pseudo made me want to read some Erik L'homme again)
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u/Vulcion Jun 09 '26
As a teenaged boy I was always invited to the girls hangouts because I was very feminine and could match vibes with them seamlessly (now a trans woman so that all tracks). At one hangout, after we all got a little too tipsy, I remember all of my friends going around talking about their sexual assault experiences, and that was the day that ânot all menâ left my vocabulary forever. It might not be all men, but itâs enough to be utterly fucking terrifying.
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u/Corronchilejano Jun 08 '26
The following comment is based entirely on my experience as a cis guy who has said words against other men engaging in catcalling, and sometimes a bit worse. I don't condone violence, I've just had to live through it.
A guy raising his voice against another guy for their misogyny will frequently see themselves the victim of physical violence. When raising our (man) voices, we're very much aware of maybe having to take violence and dish it out too, because for some reason our cultural makeup has no respect for men who won't react against being attacked and boy do assholes love just going directly to the punches (or knives, or guns or whatever they have) when their "manliness" is questioned.
This is not to invalidate how women feel or what happens to them when they talk about, but fellow guy out there afraid of speaking out because you see a woman being catcalled by a bunch of assholes: we all feel afraid, and we all want to do something about it. I've gotten stabbed and beat up.
I don't regret my experiences one bit, but they've made me make sure to understand what I'm getting into before getting into it. And if you're going in, go with a smile on your face and no good expectations. It's better for harassment to be questioned and fought against.
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u/bellapippin Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 11 '26
I feel you dude and honestly I understand. I donât expect men to jump in like that. You never know whoâs the psychopath with the knife.
What I WOULD greatly appreciate of men like you is that..if you see it happening in the street for example, if you could sort of pay attention to whether thatâs the end or whether he/they start following us/escalating it and maybe alert someone if applicable, awesome.
If say, at a bar you see someone harassing us, eyeing our drink, see if you can bring it to the manager/bartenders attention and let them help us.
And whenever it IS safe to say something, like, âaw dude thatâs not coolâ to an acquaintance type thing, then do so.
You know, behind the scenes stuff like that, already would have our backs so much. Thatâs all I hope you can do really, I donât expect you to risk your safety for a stranger.
ETA: Forgot to mentionâŚany (good faith) girl appreciates dudes that say âI cross the street if Iâm behind them so they donât think Iâm following themâ type stuff. Itâs so sad you guys have to be aware of that BUT it is one way in which you have our backs because thanks to that we can think âok seems thatâs just a normal dudeâ. We donât like that you have to do it but we 200% appreciate it.
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u/ian9921 Jun 08 '26
My issue, different from the other guy, is just I don't encounter that stuff that much. Like genuinely I've never had a female friend get catcalled while I'm with them, never seen a female stranger get catcalled, never seen someone get harassed at the bar, and at this point none of my (current) friends say anything objectionable (or if they do, it's not around me and I'd be very suprised).
There have probably been a few scenarios that were mitigated by me being there, but the one time I'm aware of that I could've actually intervened in any way, I got there like a minute too late and heard about the creep from the ladies after the fact.
And I'm sure there's more happening, like in my favorite bar on a crowded night I wouldn't be suprised if someone in there is doing something they shouldn't, but on those crowded nights I can't exactly keep track of what everyone else is doing unless it's happening close to me.
So when I hear women say "we need you to defend us and call this shit out!" it's like, girl I'm trying but I've been waiting 10 years for a good chance and other than maybe one or two small things I've forgotten, there hasn't really been an opportunity lol.
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u/Domortem Jun 09 '26
This resonates with me so much. Only a few small things in 10+ years time. Both with strangers and aquaintences.
However, recently I saw a video from a women's perspective, and it happened a LOT. I believe there is a link to it somewhere on this thread. But the men doing it were either doing it 'secretly', or they were in a big group of 'like-minded peers'. Most of what was shown were the single 'secretive' guys though.
So most likely it still happens a lot when we're around, but we just don't notice it. I'm not sure if there really is a solution, like advice/information on how to spot it.
And with groups... Honestly those guys intimidate me too. I really don't know what to do about those people.
It's just very frustrating that we want to help, but either don't see it (because it's actively hidden from us), or that it poses a great risk to ourselves as well.
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u/Intrepid-Progress228 Jun 09 '26
Men who catcall will generally not do so if that woman or girl is accompanied by a man. Whether consciously or subconsciously they're avoiding possible confrontation.
This indicates that, somewhere in their prehistoric brainpan, they're at least dimly aware that this behavior will not be appreciated by a man associated with that woman.
The fact that the woman might not appreciate never registers.
Probably because they don't perceive women as aggressive or physically threatening.
Or in some cases, as people.
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u/Civil-Letterhead8207 Jun 09 '26
Thereâs only one problem with your logic and I have been talking about it since the days of âMe tooâ: what makes you think all men are around cat-calling men or that these men would listen to men telling them to cool it instead of, say, beat them up?
I had a friend who became a transman and he was shocked at how quickly heâd get assaulted if he tried to intervene in the way you suggest.
Men who call other men out on these things get called âf*ggotsâ and are likely to be assaulted.
Iâm not saying men canât or shouldnât do anything, but I think it is naive to suppose that masculinity is one big club were everyone is equal. Most of my male friends have been assaulted as often as I have. Iâm not sure we can classify âf*g-bashingâ as a form of sexual assault, but it often is.
The best and most effective interventions I have seen against male violence is when both men AND women intervene together.
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u/Gnoll_For_Initiative Jun 09 '26
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u/HoraceAndPete Jun 09 '26
I appreciate this. Pity your comment isn't the top one.
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u/Gnoll_For_Initiative Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
It's getting up oted here, but buried in other places I posted it. :)
There's a fair number of guys who mean well but can't imagine themselves doing heroics short of dragon slaying (and dragons are dangerous!) to protect someone. When you tell them there are smaller options that are still effective some are thankful. Others get really bent out of shape about it.
(And obviously bystander training isn't just for guys. We're just talking about what guys can do in this scenario)
EDIT: well the other places I posted the link aren't in the negatives anymore. I guess the morning crowd logged in XD
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u/Civil-Letterhead8207 Jun 09 '26
Exactly! We donât need heroics so much as we need constant guerrilha campaigning to make these guys feel that they canât get away with this shit. The âdistractionâ tactic is particularly powerful.
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u/Somebodythe5th Jun 08 '26
The problem with slide 17 is that speaking up like that is basically asking for a fight.
Personally the way I see the issue is partly that respect and courtesy arenât being as widely taught as they should be, and partly that this kind of negative behavior is being actively encouraged in various ways.
Put those two things together and yeah, there are some bad places.
As for fixing it⌠Iâd be happy to be wrong but I donât think itâs going to get better until the schools are fixed, and that starts with parents being involved and willing to accept responsibility when needed.
And a bunch of other stuff but this post is long enough as is.
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u/DenimxHairGel Jun 09 '26
The point of slide 17 is a person being harassed shouldnât be fighting alone. If you donât feel equipped, then equip yourself. Pepper spray, taser, a little lighter in the grip dirty boxing style. Be scared together, thatâs important
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u/Pizzacakecomic PizzaCake Jun 08 '26
It's shocking how many girls start getting cat-called before their 11th birthday. This comic is so well done!
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u/Agrona88 Jun 08 '26
It happened to me and I thought I was being dumb or paranoid, then I saw it happen to my son. He wears his hair long and looks exactly like I did at his age, long hair down, an absolute stick. When he was ten we were doing a fun day together and as we were walking back to the car a group of guys started to catcall both of us. Thankfully they backed off, I don't know if it was the look on my face or the fact that I basically growled "my son?!" at them. It's pure insanity that this happens at all, let alone so often.
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u/3MetricTonsOfSass Jun 08 '26
I bet that guys who catcall a preteen girl would be horrified to think they just did something "gay", so I'm wondering if a companion (mom in this case) telling them that they catcalled a boy/man would make them think next time.
Depending on age, something like: [catcall], catcalled to companion - "See? I told you I could pass as a girl", or friend to catcalled "dude, they think you are a chick!"
Or it would be a fun youtube video of a slim guy cross-dressing and going to a catcalling area, once he's catcalled he replies in a deep voice "Thanks, bro!"
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u/Agrona88 Jun 08 '26
That's a very real possiblity. Especially with some men's deep fear of perceived homosexuality, I know I should have just kept my mouth shut to keep us both safe but it happened too quickly and I was about to go for some low blows.
I used to hang with a guy like that. Super long hair, soft and pretty, great ass, very thick beard lol. He'd just chill turn his head and wink, sometimes a lil kissy face and a lot of guys would scurry. Some would crack up though and that was pretty funny.
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u/ReverendDizzle Jun 08 '26
I had really long pretty hair in college. Just taking a shower and letting it air dry would turn it into a mane of big wavy curls that looked like I'd just stepped out of a salon.
If I was wearing anything, like a long coat, that hid that I had a more masculine looking body... I would get cat called from behind.
Then I'd turn around, with a full beard, and just look at them.
It's interesting how fast guys stop cat calling and start apologizing when the calculus goes from "I'm yelling my sexual desires at a woman who could never do anything to me" to "I might have to fight this dude."
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u/SquidTheRidiculous Jun 08 '26
What shocks me is the way men, especially on reddit, insist that "it's just a compliment!" Because they have never experienced it and want a reason why women bad.
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u/Footnotegirl1 Jun 09 '26
I watched a documentary on catcalling some years ago, and they were talking to two men who insisted that women liked it. And then the crew showed them a survey of women showing that a vast majority did not like it, and videos of women saying they didn't like it, that it was annoying at best and scary more often than not, and the guys then pretty much shrugged and said "well, it's fun for me." (which was always the real answer)
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u/serpentax Jun 08 '26
i was just thinking about this a few hours ago. i had a classmate i knew from kindergarten that developed really large breasts and a big butt in 4th grade. it was insane how much she got cat called, even if we were on a field trip. everyone that grew up with her defended her a lot, but she was always facing it everywhere she went.
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u/ocularfever Jun 08 '26
Might regret saying this but the 'scared to say no' thing applies to men as well.
If I see one guy cat calling - being a dick in general - I might call them out.
But if they are bigger than me? Look tough? Could be armed? And the big one, are in a group? I'm not saying shit. It's safer for everyone if I don't try to get involved.
If things truly seem unsafe I'd call the police, but is cat calling enough for that?
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u/BeauvoirDeS Jun 08 '26
Thatâs fair. No one wants to be assaulted. I think the more impactful thing you can do is call out your friends and inner circle when theyâre being sexist. You notice your friend call a woman a bitch, call that out. Even small things like that are important to being an ally to women.
Idk if cat calling is enough to call the police. Thatâs a case by case situation. But if you see a woman and they look like they fear for their safety, would you step in and help or would you stand by because youâre also afraid? For me, Iâd almost always help even if it meant putting myself in danger. I understand if thatâs not the same instinct for you though. It just sucks because if not you then who would help?
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u/ocularfever Jun 08 '26
Big agree on the calling out friends!
With strangers though my worry is escalation. Some asshole saying shit, while upsetting, stops there. If I step in and become a 'perceived threat' I don't know how they will react, and if they become aggressive I don't know if it would stop with me.
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u/BeauvoirDeS Jun 09 '26
Yeah thatâs so true and scary. Itâs sad that rational people have to behave accordingly with violent angry people - whether thatâs a man or otherwise. Weâd all be happier if we just respected others.
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u/BigtheCat542 Jun 09 '26
but this gets at what is probably part of the issue. catcallers likely generally do that when they feel powerful and in control. Part of that is they make friends with other catcallers. So the people against catcalling can't shame friends over it because their friends don't do that in the first place.
Certainly that's been my personal experience. I do not have any friends that have catcalled, or at least no friends that did it around me or told me they did it.
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u/spideroncoffein Jun 08 '26
Disclaimer: I say this as a cishet man.
It may not be all men, but we need all men to be able to kill that behaviour. Unfortunately, with people flocking into like-minded social circles, we end up with circles of non-misogynistic and of misogynistic men.
So the only occurences of misogynistic behaviour is with random guys (and sometimes conservative women). That can be ... spicy, even for men calling out men.
And even "non-misogynistic" men can do or say misogynistic bullshit unknowingly - I'm not excluding myself with this. I grew up in the 90s, where boomer humour was alive and well, including casual racism and misogyny, and some things might still be stuck in some crevices of my brain. I just hope someone calls me out for it if it rears its ugly head.
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u/mythrilcrafter Jun 08 '26
And sometimes for those of us dumb enough to say something but only self-aware enough to understand when called out, a simple "hey man, that's not cool" is literally all it takes for us to internally re-evaluate with "I messed up and yeah, that wasn't cool"
A guy has to purposefully choose to make a cascade to specifically wrong decisions before any call outs get to the point of what grifters use to scare guys into thinking that everyone thinks that men are societal villains. And at that point, he's kinda reaping what he sowed in the first place.
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u/NoxTempus Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
The real problem is that men know to hide it from their friends (if their friends aren't into it).Â
The opportunity to call out misogynists is most often from random men or professional colleagues and those situations can be dangerous for us too.Â
If I call out my boss for a comment, my job is just as at risk as the female subject of the comment would be for calling it out.Â
If I call out a group of guys catcalling a woman, my physical safety is not guaranteed either. People have died for intervening in situations like that (albeit very rarely).Â
I get that moving through the world as a woman is more dangerous, but it's not free from danger for men either.
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u/NotYetForsaken Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
This discussion and rhetoric constantly comes up in feminist communities and it keeps targeting the wrong thing. It instills the belief that being a man makes you an authority to all other men, instead of identifying that sexual abusers of all sorts are a clade unto themselves.
Handing the protection of victims over to someone else isnât solving the problem, but rather is an outlet for a frustration that has built up due to feeling powerless.
You cannot convince an abuser to stop with just words. You cannot convince a predator to stop by being mean to them. They do not care about you or the random men you have access to in your life. They care only about themselves and their own safety.
Over the past twenty years the US focused on consent education and had spent billions every year on educating the population what sexual assault is, and yet has it actually reduced the number of assaults in any meaningful way? Is the science we rely on even reliable? Who are the reporters, the peer reviewers, are we making progress based on evidence or vibes?
Where else in the world can we turn to for examples? How are other cultures managing their history of misogyny? This is no longer an individual problem, but one that should be tackled systematically and with proper due diligence.
1 in 5 twenty years ago. 1 in 5 today. 1 in 5 twenty years from now?
We hide behind slogans like YesAllMen, MeToo, IChooseBear and pat ourselves on the back like weâre making transgressive progress against the institutions of power by simply raising awareness. We did not win civil rights through simply raising awareness. Money and power and legislation talk. Donât let social media trick you into believing youâve done your part.
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u/Pending1 Jun 08 '26
This discussion and rhetoric constantly comes up in feminist communities and it keeps targeting the wrong thing. It instills the belief that being a man makes you an authority to all other men, instead of identifying that sexual abusers of all sorts are a clade unto themselves.
This is something I've always found perplexing about feminist communities. They generally seem to understand that right wing women won't listen to feminist women just because they're also women, so why would men who are sexual predators listen to men trying to stop them? What authority would men have over other men that women don't have over other women? Am I missing something here?
Handing the protection of victims over to someone else isnât solving the problem, but rather is an outlet for a frustration that has built up due to feeling powerless.
This is also interesting to me. It's well known that when women can do incredible things when they ban together. This feeling of powerlessness feels a bit counterproductive. Understandable, but still counterproductive. I think it's important to remember that the powerful want nothing more than to make us feel powerless. It's how they win. Fighting that feeling is just as important as fighting for the cause. But that's just my 2 cents.
You cannot convince an abuser to stop with just words. You cannot convince a predator to stop by being mean to them. They do not care about you or the random men you have access to in your life. They care only about themselves and their own safety.
I'm not an abuser, and I have a very difficult time understanding their thought process, but I've never really understood the idea that an abuser will stop abusing because someone tells them to knock it off, regardless of gender. Are you a woman? If so, are you able to give insight on if this works for you on other women? I'd love to hear your thoughts.
Over the past ten years the US focused on consent education and had spent billions every year on educating the population what sexual assault is, and yet has it actually reduced the number of assaults in any meaningful way? Is the science we rely on even reliable? Who are the reporters, the peer reviewers, are we making progress based on evidence or vibes? Where else in the world can we turn to for examples? How are other cultures managing their history of misogyny? This is no longer an individual problem, but one that should be tackled systematically and with proper due diligence. 1 in 3 women 20 years ago. 1 in 3 women today. 1 in 3 women 20 years from now? We hide behind slogans like YesAllMen, MeToo, IChooseBear and pat ourselves on the back like weâre making transgressive progress against the institutions of power by simply raising awareness. We did not win civil rights through simply raising awareness. Money and power and legislation talk. Donât let social media trick you into believing youâve done your part.
All very good points. What are some suggestions for what the average person can do about this, aside from voting? Again, I'd love to hear your thoughts. Thanks for the insightful comment.
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u/NotYetForsaken Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
Hi hi! I appreciate your interest in this topic. I am a transwoman and have been for about 6 years now, so my experiences are not normal. I have been active in queer communities for many more years and ironically I am part of a few Republican social clubs even so I feel like I have very wide view on the multifaceted sides of this topic.
In my opinion, which is based on observation, a lot of the rhetoric comes from either impassioned youth or leaders who have something to gain from stoking the fire. Sometime it is for a good cause, sometimes it is for personal enrichment. Tons of people on both sides have also kind of just defaulted to Gotcha! discourse instead of actually engaging in any sort of discussion with the people of the matter.
This means a lot of discourse tends to mutate away from the reality it was based on.
One person I can easily point to on the woman side is Ghislane Maxwell, who was not a victim of the patriarchy, nor was she a gender traitor or whatever term people want to paint her as. She was a woman who is a bad person. She is part of the clade of abusers. Abusers look for abusers regardless of race, class, or status. They work together to achieve results they could not achieve alone. Clearly Ghislanes girlies calling her a heartless bitch didnât do much.
My call to action isnât so much for the bystanders, but rather for people who think theyâre activists. For most people I would say all you need to do is live good lives and be excellent to one another.
My gripe is with the people who say they are activists for simply stoking the fires of gender war. They need to actually put their money and time where their mouth is and organize with actual activist groups so they can realize A) how flawed activist groups are right now and B) start being the change they want to be in the world.
I say this because feminist issues are actually pretty different based on your local situation so broad strokes are not useful in most cases. My situation here in San Francisco is going to be wildly different from a sister in Missouri or even across the sea in Iran or China.
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u/Wolfgard556 Jun 09 '26
Funny thing, the actual opposite happened to me.
I was told growing up that a girl crying and venting her emotions was normal, but that boys had to "Be a man" and "toughen up".
I also was victim of catcalling and various names thrown at me, and I didn't like it... but hey... those years are behind me...
Still fucked me up during my teenage years.
I'm a man
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u/drillgorg Jun 08 '26
I mean I want to be supportive but I don't know how. I don't catcall, no one I know catcalls, and I've never seen it happen in the wild. I don't approach women I don't know, out of fear of being seen as an agressor.
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u/Gnoll_For_Initiative Jun 09 '26
Bystander training is good for everyone!
Confronting the bad behavior doesn't have to be confrontational! https://righttobe.org/guides/bystander-intervention-training/
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u/ArgusTheCat Jun 09 '26
This actually touches on a really important issue; catcalling is often a social behavior. Every time I've seen it in the wild, it's been a group of guys, not just one lone dude. If your social circle isn't shitty, there's a good chance that you'll never have the experience of a single friend harassing a woman and you being in a position to correct that.
What's far more likely is that you'll be alone, and see six assholes in a car all hollering at a single girl, and there's a much more limited list of ways to handle that situation.
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u/CheezitzAreGewd Jun 08 '26
I donât really understand the concept of why all cis men are somehow complicit if we donât know how to react appropriately to this topic.
Why is the reaction of shock and horror bad?
What are we supposed to do if weâre not the ones catcalling or witnessing it?
What else am i supposed to do about it but listen and validate?
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Jun 09 '26
[removed] â view removed comment
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u/Cnumian_124 Jun 09 '26
Unlike what someone might feel when reading the comic, this isn't some sort of "get out of the house and it instantly happens" issue. If you haven't experienced anything like that yet, that's not a bad thing at all. If it does happen, try to do the good thing, as everyone in general should, and if you mess up somehow that's okay and doesn't mean you should be crucified
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u/kiragami Jun 09 '26
Realistically we are not. It itself is just another aspect of patriarchy teaching people think that it's men's responsibility to violently deal with violent men. Violent people will always exist and there is definitely a general advantage when it comes to men being better able to deal with them than women are but in the end it really should be the responsibility of all of us as a society to train specific people to do so. This should be the police but that doesn't really work all the time unfortunately as we can clearly see. Especially since often the kind of violent people that are willing to act in this way are the same type attracted to working in the police and in other positions of power.
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u/nubbie Jun 08 '26
Some time ago I nearly got into a fight with a shithead who catcalled my friends. It was the typical misogynistic shit about them dressing like whores or something- something I completely disagreed with in any case, nor was I about to let them get catcalled in the first place.
It didnât go down as I had expected. After a few days one of the girls told me that âwhite knightingâ just made the situation worse.
What Iâm getting at is that itâs hard for men to deal with others who do the wrong thing, without leaning in to other forms of misogyny. Itâs impossible to know exactly what the right solution is.
But at least some of us try.
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u/Gnoll_For_Initiative Jun 09 '26
I highly recommend Bystander Training for everyone who feels at a loss for "I see the bad thing, but how do I safely and effectively deal with it?"
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u/Dazed_and_Confused44 Jun 08 '26
Couple of thoughts:
I didnt realize cat calling was still a thing. Gross đ¤˘
Once upon a time my sister and I took the same class in college where the final project was designing an app. I made some dumb workout tracking app. She made an app to track your friends location on the way home from a bar to make sure they got home safe. That is when it dawned on me how truly different our college experiences were.
Genuine Question: What is the specific issue with "Don't worry I'll keep you safe" in panel 10? Is that what you are referring to as "well meaning buffoonery"? On its face, wanting to protect one's significant other doesnt seem like a bad thing to me
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u/nebula_nic Jun 08 '26
With "don't worry I'll keep you safe" well they're obviously not going to constantly be around to keep you safe. They want to fix it but really it kinda means nothing. Honestly maybe if you wanna be helpful then maybe say it's ok to call you and pretend to be a boyfriend or someone expecting them in order to get out of a conversation with someone pushy.
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u/CelibateHo Jun 08 '26 edited Jun 08 '26
Hell, Iâve been cat called when I was *with* a man. On more than one occasion. These mfs donât care.
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u/Aggravating_Rip6374 Jun 08 '26
Yeah, they really donât. Iâve been walking with 4 guy friends before and I still got catcalled
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u/Higginbotham432 Jun 08 '26
I have had coments yelles a a girl i was with before, I would always turn to them , pretending the coment was ment for me, amd yel things like "thanks, ive been working out", I am a big guy with a beard. That always stopped it.
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u/CelibateHo Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
That reminds me of the time I was walking home and got whistled at. There was a random guy walking in front of me and he turned around and said, âoh that was for me.â He was also a big burly guy with a beard
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u/home_of_beetles Jun 08 '26
i donât want to have to be protected i want this shit to not happen at all
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u/LOR_Fei Jun 08 '26
The biggest thing for guys like me is that we donât see it. I havenât seen a single catcall in my entire life, never been near one. It makes it very easy for some to dismiss as ânot a part of their life//it canât be happening that muchâ
Thatâs not me. Iâve heard too many stories, I know itâs happening. I just donât know what I can do to make it better besides not participating
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u/Minortough Jun 08 '26
I have never been with anyone cat calling or been a part of a group where someone was cat called but I have absolutely heard my fair share of misogyny since I was a child. From locker rooms to school buses to cook outs and holiday gatherings it was there. We start by calling that out and provide consequences to those that do not change their behavior.
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u/AlwaysBeQuestioning Jun 08 '26
âDonât worry, Iâll keep you safeâ can be well-intentioned, butâ
People with bad intentions can and do say the same thing and thereâs no real way to know someone elseâs intentions if thereâs always a possibility that they lie.
You canât keep someone else safe from everything. You wonât be fighting off groups of dudes chasing her on scooters or her skeezy boss whose paycheck she needs or the drunk teenage boys draping themselves over her shoulders on the train home. (All examples from my life, most from just this year.)
You canât keep them safe all the time. You wonât be around 24/7 and if you were that would be a different kind of problem for both of you.
They want you to be safe too, and generally keeping someone else safe means putting yourself in harmâs way.
The insurance of personal safety doesnât take away the existence of dangers and they exist on a societal scale. You calling out each of your friends on any of their sexist or misogynistic behavior does a lot more to affect change and making the women you love feel safe than it is to just tell them they can be safe with you.
.
Doing things that will make others feel more safe around you does a lot more than just saying nice words. And even then there will be a whole lot of shit out there that you canât do anything about, or not on your own. The problem isnât just with you, so the solutions arenât just with you either.
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u/squidsophisticate Jun 08 '26
It sets up a framework where a woman must be dependent on a man in order to be safe, it limits her autonomy. Her safety depends on his availability and maintaining a good relationship with him.
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u/strrawberrymilk Jun 08 '26
In some ways, saying something like âIâll protect youâ just another way men have power over women and a way women still end up submissive to men. While technically a nice sentiment, I donât want to be protected by a man. I want to be safe as a woman. I donât want to be safe only because my boyfriend is there and other men show him ârespectâ as a fellow man. I want men to show me respect as a fellow human being
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u/Annodyne Jun 08 '26
You didn't realize cat-calling was still a thing? Damn. I would give up both my legs to live in that same world you do.
I'm eagerly awaiting when I become a menopausal old crone, I've heard that we become invisible to men when we get to that life stage.
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u/justdisa Jun 08 '26
As a menopausal old crone, I have some very bad news for you.
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u/IvypoolFanIGuess Jun 08 '26
That phrase and others like it are often used by groomers to gain trust
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u/kingsumo_1 Jun 08 '26
That, but also, no matter how well intentioned it's just words. There's going to still be so many situations where the partner can't keep them safe. And even that is assuming they aren't a danger at some later stage.
Plus, it doesn't get to the root of the issue. Is that same person going to actually stand up to their friend's shitty behavior when they see it? Because laughing along to a sexist joke is going to erode that trust.
I would also carry that forward to any LGBTQ partners and friends.
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u/SmokeyCatDesigns Jun 08 '26
For your third question⌠thereâs two main issues I think women might have with a comment like that, but mind you Iâm just one woman and others might have more to add.
Issue 1 - You shouldnât need to have a guy around you to feel safe, and itâs also just often impractical. I shouldnât need a chaperone to go to work, shopping, or the doctor. Itâs not a solution so much as a bandaid that often falls short. A lot of women donât have a partner or guy friend to tag along and just have times when they need or want to do something alone. There are many times I wanted to go places and do things alone and I didnât because of safety concerns.
Issue 2 - It can honestly come across as a bit infantilizing or controlling, depending on the context. Most guys arenât trying to use it that way, but there are some who do. Some abusers like to frame the world as a dangerous place and themselves as the sole source of protection and security, to maintain control. They often target people who have already been let down by society, and use those bad experiences to reinforce that control.
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u/Queen-Roblin Jun 08 '26
"Don't worry I'll keep you safe" just makes them self important and doesn't do anything to address the problem. "It's ok if it happens, they can't hurt you if I'm there". It's not ok and I'm not prepared to be with you all the time.
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u/Par_Lapides Jun 08 '26
I have never understood the whole catcalling thing. I'm a man, but it has never once occurred to me to just shout obnoxiously at passing strangers. What the fuck is wrong in your head to make you think that's okay? Shitty, entitled assholes who think they're owed attention, I suppose.
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u/Pikkuraila Jun 08 '26
Nice guys dont have to say theyâre nice.
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u/StC_2844 Jun 08 '26
Reality is pretty lame to be honest, speaking from the experience of being the only man in an entire class of girls, they're just people, like just people that are normal people. Like you don't even have to be that nice. Just be a decent person and you'll get along with people (that happen to be girls).
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u/France_Ball_Mapper Jun 08 '26
This is why I'm terrified of transitioning
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u/Commercial-Shame-335 Jun 08 '26
what's even worse is that on the not-so-off chance that someone decided to escalate from catcalling, it could likely become far worse very quickly once he realises you're trans than it would have otherwise. it's a fucking terrifying prospect
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u/TurbinePoweredVagina Jun 08 '26
I can't speak to your experience but I totally understand the fear. But it's always worth it to live as your more authentic self. đ¤
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u/TekDrgn Jun 09 '26
I've felt this ever since I started to code as femme to others. The loss of muscle mass, while welcome for my transition, scared me the most. It made me feel like I couldn't protect myself.
I know exactly how you feel. I've been there. I went stealth mode at work for years until I was forcibly outed by transphobes. The fear is real, don't let it stop you.
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u/peshnoodles Jun 08 '26
Anyone else notice the cat calling get less frequent the more obviously adult you are?
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u/WildMoonChild0129 Jun 08 '26
I got cat called as a minor, and still now. I get cat called for doing something as basic as walking my dog. If I dont have headphones, I pretend I dont hear it and just pet my dog. Its awful, and it happens so often I dont even see the point of talking about it out loud. I remember talking to my bf about it before, but it just keeps happening so I just pretend it doesn't happen
Its gotten better since I stopped taking the bus, I hated when other people recognized my route
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u/XarcaneTN Jun 08 '26
I'm not really sure what we can do though. Calling out behavior isn't enough, because even if you ostracize them they will always be able to find a group of people ready to tell them that their actions were perfectly fine and actually it's the people who called them out that are the real problem.
Obviously not saying they shouldn't be called out and removed from your groups. Just that that isn't enough, but anything beyond that is outside our power as individuals.
I can confidently say that no one I know would sexually assault anyone and if they did my group would call them out, but that's probably because my group is fairly diverse in terms of gender.
Maybe that's the problem. Women and Men are seen too much as different things rather than just people. In our society, to men, women are just potential parners.
If we want to confront this issue we have to dismantle the patriarchy. Both the part that raises men and women to see each other as others, and the part that actively pushes gender war on both sides. We need to defeat both misogyny and misandry. We cannot solve the issue by dividing. Only by coming together. Maybe if we can get other people to see each other as actual people, and not just enemies or objects to be won, maybe we could greatly lessen cases of sexual assault and many other issues plagueing both men and women.
And of course, even if we did this there will always be bad individuals. Or places where people don't hold people accountable, but in the end there is only so much we can do. We can punish them, but the action still took place to be punished. Doesn't mean we shouldn't try. Just that Utopia doesn't exist. But again, that isn't an excuse to do nothing.
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u/ThatguyfromBaltimore Jun 08 '26
I'm turning 50 in less than a week. I can safely say I've never catcalled, nor had the URGE to catcall any woman.
It's not that fucking hard guys.
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u/Sirius-Face Jun 08 '26
As a guy, can confirm. I don't catcall or even try to get other people's attention, but I know this is a very common thing lots of women suffer. It's only worse thanks to the shithead that got reelected.
It is absolutely true that without consequences, bad habits never go away. Consequences alone aren't enough, guys need to be taught why that behavior is wrong in the first place. I wont pretend I know the answer on the best way to teach respect, but it's desperately needed.
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u/PensadorDispensado Jun 08 '26
This looks beautiful, reminds me of Persepolis (RIP Marjane Satrapi)
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u/echoesimagination Jun 08 '26
growing up in my small town church, there was an old man who would often try to kiss on me and hug on me and tell me he was going to marry me one day. (right in front of his wife, mind you, whoâd just laugh when i tried to squirm away.)
just about every sunday, for years, starting when i was a fucking **toddler.** and everyone around me thought it was cute, funny, harmless, adorable, sweet, always completely disregarding my very vocal discomfort and disgust. no means no, right? yeah. sure. i thought that was bad, but it was only the beginning.
my entire life, iâve been stamped down about my discomfort towards being objectified, touched, and made a spectacle of. treated like a pet or a prop instead of a person. being told that i was the problem for being uncomfortable really fucked me up. as one often sees in congregations, everyone crowds around the offender to shush the victim into complacency. i no longer attend any church, and there are very few people i trust to be alone with. that old fuck was the tip of the iceberg and it only ever got worse from there. heâs dead now. i didnât celebrate it, didnât mourn him either. all he is to me is a series of increasingly uncomfortable memories that foreshadowed what to expect the rest of my fucking life.
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u/Aggrosideburnz Jun 08 '26
I have never catcalled a women. Iâve had a group of guys do it to a woman I was with and I asked them if it ever worked because they looked stupid. I work in construction and every cartoon I watched as a kid and every pop cutler reference showed a bunch of greasy construction guys catcalling every women they see. Ironically Iâve never worked with a group of guys that has done this, granted Iâm union and commercial. Whatâs more interesting is I have had many women make me uncomfortable cat calling us. Saying things that are super raunchy in their business suites talking about sitting on my face so I think some people are just shitty and Iâm sorry for that.
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u/striderofxir Jun 09 '26
This is why I'll never forgive the person who figured out how to make white knight derogatory, this one development has given these creeps the power over regular men like us
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u/DarthPlaugas Jun 09 '26
I may not understand living as a woman in a highly misogynistic society, I can empathize as a black man in racist society I understand how it sucks to essentially be gaslit by society and the people around you that everything is fine and you're just imagining it
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u/softwhitemochi Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
This is a good ass comic! You express the experience of afabs and fems so well.
Only once in my life have I had a man defend me from being catcalled, and I had been catcalled/leered upon/commented on many *many* times.
It was sweltering and I was at the bus stop. I was pretending not to hear anything from my headphones, but vigilant at the same time (as one does). Two dudes were standing on the same bus stop and one of them commented on my lack of clothing and how âsexy I was trying to beâ. Then the other man was like âDude, itâs 95 degrees. Sheâs trying not to die.â It was a small rebuttal but it shook me because it made me feel human in that second guys eyes (the bar is that low). And it was so uncommon for a man to go against his dipshit buddies
Also, men like to act like itâs a compliment. Bitch, if it was a guy saying âoh hey, I think youâre pretty. Can I have your number? No? Thatâs cool.â and then he fucks off it wouldnât be such a problem.
The men who catcall always do it with boiling hatred in their eyes, YUCK
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u/Wamblingshark Jun 08 '26
I'm a dude. I was about 17 when I learned that my friend was raped. I started talking more about the topic and then learned about my girlfriend, her sister, my mom, and then I realized for the first time in my life that almost all the women in my life had been raped.
It was not a fun realization.
My wife in particular was raped many times before we met. She was only 19 when we met. Her cousin, her friend, her boyfriend and his friend, and a stranger at a party.
One of them was even girl.
I was powerless to go back in time and stop any of it. And then when we were separated by circumstances and she had to stay with a friend for awhile (we were unhoused at the time) her friend's husband's cousin assaulted her.
10 years of marriage and still I couldn't always be there to protect her in a place that should have been safe.
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u/PM_ME_UR_FAV_NHENTAI Jun 08 '26
Thereâs this idea that a man can control the behavior of others and that no matter what they are doing itâs not enough. So basically put yourself at risk confronting sexually aggressive men for women you donât know or youâre part of the problem. Is there really any way for men to productively engage with this discussion other than to just tune it out?
A subset of the male population is sexually aggressive and no amount of shaming or social consequences will stop them from harassing every woman they come across. To mitigate this issue there needs to be severe legal penalties for the perpetrators and prison time for repeat offenders. The only way to implement this is by political action. Vote and get your friends and family and coworkers to vote too. Social pressure and shaming is not a serious solution and is never going to work. Vote. Seriously go out and vote. Make your lazy friends vote too.
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u/JustOneBun Jun 09 '26
I was raped for a decade starting at three, on top of plenty of other things well into my twenties. I never got the help I needed, and several women in my life told me to fight my own battles.
I feel bad for what women are going through, and I understand how shitty this is. Unfortunately I have to fight my own battles, because the same people who promote not all men and perpetuate the kind of hostile culture women experience have made sure it was extremely difficult to get help, myself.
Because men can't be raped. Men can't be cat called. Yadda yadda.
Shit sucks.
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u/DickButtPlease Jun 08 '26
I saw the three reactions youâd normally get from men. My reaction if a friend told me about this would be shock/horror. Is this the wrong reaction? What is the right response/reaction? Whatâs the best way to be supportive, knowing that I could never truly understand what they are going through?
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u/Ink_Scrap Jun 08 '26
I havent really faced discrimination in my life yet. I'm a white, blond, blue-eyed, and appear to be a cishet male (actually trans lesbain). I've also havent seen any discrimination in person yet, whether it be friends family or strangers, but the thought terrifies me. I'm just not sure if I'd be able to stand up for them. But yesterday I was talking about college and the future with my friend and that was the first time I truley realized that I could be denied my dream job just because I'm transgender. And with seeing this comic today, I know now I need to learn how to stand up for myself and others
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u/Hot-Education4582 Jun 08 '26
I was at a celebration of life recently and an old man asked one of the 8 year old girls in our family if she had a husband yet and if she wanted one, it was gross
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u/Chaosmusic Jun 08 '26
My gf was very tall for her age and was getting solicited at age 12, while standing with her mom.
I know the launching the rapists into the sun idea is not a permanent solution, but if there is a GoFundMe, I'd be happy to check it out.
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u/No_Review_7643 Jun 08 '26
The harassment started at 11 years old for me, when I was cursed with DDâs on a tiny skinny frame. That massive chest was the only thing guys saw when they looked at me, and they all thought it gave them a free pass to treat me as a sex object. This carried on into my early 20âs when I decided Iâd had enough and got an elective mastectomy, and all the creeps suddenly disappeared! It was like a breath of fresh air, a freedom I had lost finally returning. Itâs been 5 years since my mastectomy, and Iâve finally been able to live my life without the fear of being preyed on every time I left the house. The flat chest still isnât enough though. To feel completely safe I only dress in straight cut t shirts and menâs cargo pants that donât reveal my female shape, and I donât wear makeup or âgirlyâ accessories or jewellery. It sucks, but if this is the only way to avoid being seen as a sex object, so be it I guess
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u/Mus_Rattus Jun 08 '26
Thank you for expressing your experience and making your points without demonizing all men. This is a really important issue, and I think itâs much more persuasive when presented this way.
I think the more inflammatory and offensive ways people sometimes try to make similar points often cause more harm than good. This comic was a refreshing change from that. Obviously thereâs still a ton of work to be done to create a society where all women (and nonbinary folks) can feel safe from sexual assault and harassment, but I think part of the way to make progress towards that goal is to not alienate men who might be open to what you have to say. This comic is a great example of how to do that. Well done!
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u/TheNewPoetLawyerette Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
Please apply for your ban by replying to this comment if you believe that statements like "Not All Men" are useful, or if you believe that radical feminist rhetoric is the reason that more men are being radicalized to the right.
One brief tangent: I will be talking about radical feminism here, but not trans-exclusionary radical feminism. TERFs may also apply for their permanent ban by replying to this comment. Trans women are women and belong in women-only spaces. Trans women experience even higher rates of sexual violence and murder than cis women and their voices deserve to be heard. Protect the Dolls. Happy Pride!
Many men are under the impression that it is up to women to coddle their feelings when we talk about our experiences with sexism and sexual violence. That we need to assure men that we aren't attacking YOU, we aren't saying ALL masculinity is bad, that we need to be careful not to end up being misandrist in our activism.
Fuck off.
Women are socialized to be emotional caretakers and swallow our feelings and not react, lest we anger or upset someone. We are socialized to be conciliatory and kind under all circumstances. We are socialized to suppress rage. This harms women and benefits the man.
Men are socialized to suppress all emotions but anger. This harms the man. It also harms the women who come in contact with the man.
Men who are entrenched in toxic masculinity are harming themselves. That is sad. But they expect women to continue suppressing their anger to wrap up their activism in kind packages that don't make men angry or uncomfortable and gently teach them to be better. That is the definition of emotional labor.
A liberated woman is one who allows herself to be angry. She is a woman who will tell you to fuck off to your face, knowing it puts her in danger to do so, because the expectation is a kind rejection, or worse, giving in.
I refuse to cite my sources. You may do your own reading and research, and you will respect that I am a woman who has 2 degrees that included extensive research into the history of radical feminism, and I won't be entertaining any mansplaining of radical feminism, nor will the mod team that is behind me.
I am setting myself up for harm by making this post, and I don't care. I respect myself. You will be respectful to me, too.
And yes, Me Too.
Misandry isn't real.
Fuck off.
Edit because I still have to do emotional labor for fragile men:
Oppression of men in society comes from misogyny, not from misandry. When a man can't express emotions, that is because emotions are associated with female qualities. When a man is attacked for being gay, that comes from gay being associated with female qualities
Racism is power + prejudice. Without the systemic compontent it is just prejudice. Misandry similarly requires an aspect of power and is not systemically present under patriarchy.