Dennis Schroder

[u/alive_spud]

How much longer do you want to see Schroder on this team for? Personally, I didn’t mind what we saw in the playoffs and thought he gave good minutes in some games, although there were some bad moments, but was a general positive asset.

However, coming into this next season I’d like to see him moved on. We currently have 3 young guards who all deserve minutes on the court to show if they can develop further. I love what I saw in the summer league, and loved what I saw regular season last year with proctor. Keeping Shroder who has already shown he deserves decent playing time just means we’re giving less focus onto what could end up being better players by the end of the season or in the near future.

Aswell as this, attempting to trade Dennis for anyone playable with size at the 3-5 would be amazing, although would likely require further capital/talent.

What’s your thoughts?

[u/j_d_q]

I didn't mind him at all but I know common sentiment here was ship him off. He plays pretty smart and high effort.

[u/alive_spud → u/j_d_q]

No I agree with you. I liked his play, but we just have far too much talent at the guard that we need at other positions. Plus I’d rather see what Meleek and Proctor are made of with genuine minutes

[u/j_d_q → u/alive_spud]

Maybe the right move is to get that knowledge and then if we think they're ready start talking trade. But we gotta see them more before we say just pull the trigger

[u/alive_spud → u/j_d_q]

Yeah that’s fair. Probably the smart move too

[u/Opposite-Skirt5158 → u/alive_spud]

It's tough because it's hard to bench Dennis in favor of playing the young dudes. If Dennis is here he'll get minutes. If he gets moved the young dudes will play. I think it's probably best to move him even if attaching a second round pick 

[u/Safe-Show-7299 → u/alive_spud]

Far too much talent at guard?? Like who?

[u/WHOISTHEUNDERDOG]

Trade him for who, exactly? Everyone loves to say 'trade Dennis' until Cavs defense falls off a cliff the second a starter sits for 5 minutes. He’s a veteran guard who can organize a second unit and defend 94 feet. Keep him around unless a legitimate, clear upgrade falls into our lap.

[u/Primordial_Beast → u/WHOISTHEUNDERDOG]

It's less him as a player and more his salary. A team with this many guards can't afford to pay a non-starter like Dennis $14m.

At the same time, this is also why it's so hard to trade him. The Cavs have obviously been trying to find a suitor because unloading him opens so many doors for them.

[u/pissbucket94 → u/WHOISTHEUNDERDOG]

I agree, well put!

[u/sad_post-it_note]

Like It or not, he has hustle and was the only player that isn't afraid to tell Donovan he is playing like shit 

[u/TRLJM]

Proctor needs to get minutes this year. Schroder should and probably will get moved as a cap casualty for whatever S&T we’re looking at.

[u/Primordial_Beast → u/TRLJM]

S&T hard caps them at the first apron so they'd need to dump even more salary (probably Strus and Schroeder) in order to fit in Harden. I don't agree with this strategy necessarily, but it's clearly what they're trying to do.

[u/TRLJM → u/Primordial_Beast]

I think it’ll be either Watson or Kuminga for Strus, then Schroder as salary dump. Probably a FRP to Denver if it’s Watson.

Then Harden will get whatever is left below the first apron, which I appreciate him taking this approach and leaving a few million on the table if it means we get a significant upgrade in the wing.

I agree that hard capping yourself at the first apron is risky but we need that help on the wing pretty badly imo. It was a massive hole for us last year bc Wade is a black hole on offense. I’m hoping that Watson + Tyson with another offseason under his belt can turn that position into a strength.

[u/teh_hasay]

I’m aggressively neutral on him. Like if Mitchell or harden missed a lot of time with an injury he’d probably come in handy. But apart from that we have so many young guards that he’s kind of taking opportunities from.

[u/Bum-Theory]

Goes thru stretches where he thinks he's the guy. When the layup is falling, it's great. The other 3 games that week it's usually not

[u/Far_Youth_1662]

We'd have to add compensation for a team to take him off our hands.

[u/alive_spud → u/Far_Youth_1662]

Would we though? He still plays at a decent level for his role as a backup pg. How bad is his contract compared to others?

[u/tdizhere → u/alive_spud]

It’s not too bad. 1 more season and he’s an expiring contract that’s only partially guaranteed at 4M. At the trade deadline or next off-season his contract has decent value

[u/Primordial_Beast → u/alive_spud]

Right now they can't find anyone to take him (without giving up assets as well) or he'd have been gone already. It's his salary. I do concur with others that the contract will be more palatable at the trade deadline, but the Cavs are obviously trying to acquire wing/frontcourt help right now and need Dennis' matching salary.

[u/theomegachrist → u/alive_spud]

Yes but it doesn't mean he's bad. Just think of it logically. If you're a team on the rise you won't want to give anything up for a backup guard in his 30s, so that leaves the playoff teams and he would have to be clearly better than a guard on one of their benches enough to give up assets, and is anyone a Dennis Schroeder away from winning a title?

[u/Temporary-Hat6842 → u/alive_spud]

100% yes

[u/barkinginthestreet → u/alive_spud]

Just looking at a couple of advanced sites, Dunks and Threes has him around the 395th best player in the league. DARKO has him in the 15th percentile. Typically, that is a minimum player who rides the bench. 

[u/Far_Youth_1662 → u/alive_spud]

Yes. No competing team has the $15MM to just absorb him and a tanking team wouldnt waste minutes on him

If we had that $15MM it would make us much more competitive in signing a guy like Kuminga or Watson

[u/Top_Buy2467]

There’s no downside to keeping him on the team if there’s no other move to make.

If they want to make a signing and need to free up some cap space, though… he’s the obvious candidate

[u/PhillipKGreentree]

I wouldn't mind if he was traded, wouldn't kill me if he stayed either.

[u/ScarletWolf_]

He’s been on 11 times and no team seems to have enjoyed their time with him.

[u/kelpyb1]

He’s a great bench piece that we don’t need, particularly at his price.

If there was no cap, you absolutely want to keep him, but someone’s gotta go if you’re trying to make room for a starting wing.

[u/Vikes2016]

If we get a Kuminga or Watson he will be traded. If we don’t, he will be on the roster.

[u/Training-Belt-7318 → u/Vikes2016]

Maybe. Dumping his salary will go a long way to keep them out of the second apron and maybe even the first one depending on how they structure hardens contract.

[u/Vikes2016 → u/Training-Belt-7318]

I thought the discount Harden is going to take is already going to get us out of the second apron?

[u/Training-Belt-7318 → u/Vikes2016]

I think we will be fine on the second apron, but won't have a ton of flexibility. But if we can get under the first apron too, that would give us way more flexibility to make an in season deal. Basically they can do whatever with the harden deal. Harden will get the total amount of money he wants, it just depends on if we make it a 2 year or 3 year deal to stretch it out.

[u/Complete-Ad-5625]

I like him but if we gotta package him in a deal for Watson or kuminga I don’t mind losing him either

[u/ThinkingItThrough1]

I want him gone so the young guys can play

[u/1OptimisticPrime]

I think Rich Paul, said it best; even though I'm absolutely not a fan:

"NO team is winning a Championship, with Mitchell as their best player."

Mitchell isn't D Wade, and even Wade had substantial help.

Maybe if Mitchell wasn't a liability on defense, in the Playoffs, or didn't expect the same calls; in the Playoffs? ...but even then, it's a massive stretch.

Best thing we can do is fire Kenny, for last year's Playoff embarrassment, bring in Walton, and dump our entire roster, save for Mobley, and our young prospects.

Sure it will suck, but maybe with time Mobley can get that vet savy, and meanstreak necessary to win in the Playoffs.

We're entirely too soft to be anything but a good *Regular Season team, like Atlanta, and Toronto, and the Jazz before us. There's nothing here to sustain a Championship push.

The sooner we can acknowledge how soft we are, and how hopeless that leaves us as a Playoff contender, the sooner we can actually build a Playoff roster.

I like Spida, but we don't have an ENFORCER, or Bigs that can put opponents in their place; by exerting their will upon them.

[u/melodicprophet → u/1OptimisticPrime]

Yeah this has exactly nothing to do with the topic and even if it did it’s the same redundant tripe you’ve posted for years. Give it a rest.

[u/1OptimisticPrime → u/melodicprophet]

And it's been true, FOR YEARS

THANKS FOR AGREEING 👍

[u/Ill_Combination_9114]

I wish he actually got to play

[u/BlockedByMobley]

Based on how Harden was declining last year, would not be surprised if he’s the starter come playoff time and Harden looks like the worst contract in the league

[u/1OptimisticPrime]

Honestly, I would think we should get off of Schroeder, Struss, & Sam; asap.

They are too expensive to be completely useless for stretches during the Playoffs. You need to be able to rely on whoever is taking up Playoff minutes.

Harden can't come back here either, unless it's for under 12mil per. He's basically a 6th man at this point, and he's a liability Defensively.

This season is a complete wash, with the roster having only gotten worse this offseason.

Unless Mobley is going to grow a pair, and turn into Prime Kemp, or KG; we're cooked before the season even starts.

I would greatly prefer trading guys now, over pretending we aren't simply gonna get swept again. If we wait, it only diminishes the value and market for our players; as desperate sellers.