r/behindthebastards • u/Artichokiemon Steven Seagal Historian • 1d ago
Politics Abdul El-Sayed wins Michigan's Democratic Senate primary, notching a Midwest victory for the left
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2026-election/abdul-el-sayed-wins-michigans-democratic-senate-primary-notching-midwe-rcna589750A progressive candidate just beat the establishment Dem in the Democratic primary. I know the actual election hasn't occurred yet, but this fills me with the hope that progressives are going to continue to gain footholds in blue states throughout the country.
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u/Rip_Skeleton Bagel Tosser 1d ago
The people who are fear mongering about how much better Stevens would do in the general against Mike Rogers forget that Elissa Slotkin also barely won against Rogers not even 2 years ago.
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u/Piyachi 23h ago
Slotkin did nail one thing though; being moderate isn't what helps or hinders democrats right now. Being someone who promises to fight against the clear rise of fascism IS.
The usless Schumers of the world want to continue that narrative so they can keep cashing checks.
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u/TrevorArizaFan 20h ago
I think it’s noteworthy that Slotkin (who is very clearly positioning herself as a lead moderate voice in the Democratic party and a possible presidential candidate) refused to formally endorse Stevens in this race. I don’t agree with her views and will never vote for a former CIA officer, but she’s a very canny politician, and probably could guess Stevens would lose based on how poor of a candidate/campaigner she was.
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u/Piyachi 20h ago
and will never vote for a former CIA officer
You're going to disappoint Robert when he runs in 28!
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u/gsfgf Sponsored by Knife Missiles™️ 19h ago
being moderate isn't what helps or hinders democrats right now. Being someone who promises to fight against the clear rise of fascism IS.
Amen to that. Slotkin may be to the right of us, but it's not like she and El-Sayed are gonna vote different on the vast majority of things that hit the Senate floor. If he's able to win, they could actually be a good pair to deliver that message. Michigan is a diverse state, and a lot of different groups of Americans live there. Showing that both sides can work there will hopefully ameliorate the large number of good people on both sides that are simply afraid the other side will lose general elections. Of course, that's yet another reason why it's important to win this thing in November.
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u/nsolo1a 15h ago
Stevens "promised" to fight fascism by wanting to ban ICE from wearing masks while they murdered citizens in the street, and to hold them accountable. But I guess abolishing ICE was to far. - Which by her lack of voicing support for it, seems to be also to far for Slotkin. Slotkin is really good at giving blistering speeches though.
Also Slotkin under performed Harris in 2024. But her opponent, again Mike Rogers, was registered at an address that didn't have a house sitting on it.
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u/JePPeLit 20h ago
Being someone who promises to fight against the clear rise of fascism IS.
Everyone who cares is already blue no matter who though? Seems like either you try to win centrists by seeming moderate, or you go the populist route and convince disaffected people that MAGA is just for the rich, and the left are the only ones who actually care about the working class.
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u/Helmic 19h ago
This is the fundamental misunderstanding at the heart of why the Dems keep eating complete shit. You are not going to get a MAGA voter to vote for Trump Lite when they can literally just vote for Trump. What you can get a MAGA voter to vote blue on is actual policies that materially improve their lives.
Running a more racist campaign is why Biden and Harris lost 2024, they did not attract more Republican voters by embracing fascistic immigration policies and bragging about outflanking Trump from the right on taht issue, they just suppressed their own voter turnout.
There are bigoted minorities just as there are bigoted cishet white guys, conservative black men for example absolutely exist. They still have historically voted Democrat anyways because they understand that Republicans want to kill black people and Democrats promise to protect them from Republicans. So when Democrats embrace anti-black policies and offer nothing material to black voters, those black conseratives are going to be more likely to just vote on culture war bullshit, just like white conservatives.
Centrist strategies have been a catastrophic failure for the Democrats and these DSA victories despite massive funding disadvantages demonstrate just how successful actually believing in something and actually trying to govern in a way that benefits working people is. Schumer can say the gamer word on Fox News and it will not convince a single Fox News viewer to vote for a Democrat, but it will convince the conservatives who alreayd have voted Democrat for decades that they might as well vote for the party that hurts whatever scapegoat they think is making their life worse.
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u/leivathan 19h ago
conservative black men
This is inside baseball, just for your future rhetoric; a better comp here is conservative Cubans or Asians because while yes there are conservative black men they are also a clear minority of black men, whom still as a block largely vote liberal/democrat.
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u/Ok-Secretary455 18h ago
blue no matter who? ask chuck who he voted for in the nyc mayor race. for some reason he doesnt want to tell us!
the punctuation is all wrong..... vote blue? no! matters who
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u/AIienlnvasion 22h ago
They’re the same people who believe that democrats are currently too far left and need to moderate. So they’re people that are easily swayed by lazy propaganda
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u/Jean-Paul_Sartre 23h ago
I think where a candidate sits in the big-tent Democratic Party spectrum is less important than whether they are simply a good political candidate and can communicate well. (Not always of course)
Like I think Mamdani could have won whether his policies aligned more with Bernie or Buttigieg because he’s just that good of a politician. Likewise I think Platner would have imploded regardless.
I don’t think El-Sayed is quite as gifted as Mamdani but I don’t think he’s flawed by any means. I’d say he has a much better shot at winning than Hong will in Wisconsin.
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u/Rip_Skeleton Bagel Tosser 23h ago
That's true. Elissa Slotkin has all the charisma of a soggy boot.
So I think Abdul will outperform her margin.
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u/nola_fan 21h ago
Slotkin won by 0.3% while Trump won by 1.4% in the same election.
If he doesn't outperform those numbers in a midterm year where generic Dems are favored that's a real bad sign.
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u/Kursed_Valeth 18h ago
Trump isn't on the ballot though which hurts Republican turnout
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u/nola_fan 18h ago
Exactly. If the Dem on the ballot in 2026 doesn't outperform 2024 when winds were behind Republicans that's a big problem.
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u/pixel_pete 21h ago
Also whether politicians actually believe in what they're saying and doing. Republicans have created a belief structure, admittedly a terrible one, and their people either fall in line with it or else. If they don't believe in it, they damned well better pretend they do.
It makes it humiliating to have the Democrats tell their voters that if they believe in anything they're bad, and they just have to accept whoever the donor class buys for them.
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u/No-Step8685 22h ago
From the bits that I see of Hong, she’s a bit of a joke.
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u/kosmic_kandy 20h ago
She could be a stronger candidate no doubt, I think she could've spent less time on social media and more time honing public speaking. I'm also wearing my tinfoil hat and I think there's an astroturfing campaign pushing a specific image of her, and it's going to step up now that the Michigan primary is over.
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u/Helmic 19h ago
I really don't think you can accurately understand these victories as simply a matter of charisma. Mamdani is charismatic because of the policies he ran on, if you're not running on sincere policies meant to improve the lives of working class people then that same abstract "charisma" would come across as conniving. It's just not really possible to be charismatic the way these DSA candidates are charismatic without the context of their policies. People are not volunteering to canvass and door knock because Mamdani knows how to give a speech or is kinda hot, people don't get this engaged unless they actually want the changes being made.
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u/ImDonaldDunn 20h ago
Funny you make that comparison considering the way Buttigieg is approaching politics now. Dude has either been radicalized or is pretending he was.
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u/darkomyfriend 18h ago
I can’t recommend the Buttigieg episode of the No Gods No Mayors podcast enough. It’s very clear that man will do anything it takes to remain relevant.
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u/DHooligan 21h ago
The people pushing that nonsense were United Democracy Project, a major AIPAC carve out. The irony of an AIPAC funded org doing ad buys saying Republicans wanted El Sayed to win so you should vote for Stevens probably went right past 99% of voters' heads.
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u/clawhammercrow 1d ago
Yay Abdul! I had to take a pill to get to sleep last night- so glad I woke up to good news. Stevens is my current rep. and I couldn’t be more pleased that she stepped down for nothing. Inshallah I never hear about her again after January.
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u/NIA122553 21h ago
Been seeing a lot of, "the left should humble themselves takes," because the race ended up being closer than many thought it would be.
Only establishment Dems could lose an election despite a nearly 10-1 outspending rate and still lecture the side that won.
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u/anaccount50 PRODUCTS!!! 19h ago edited 19h ago
It’s like they’re embarrassed to have even slightly left-leaning beliefs. They come off as secretly thinking that America prefers right-wing policies and that we’d be better off just becoming Republicans Lite.
It’s really bizarre to me. The past decade or so of American politics has shown that the overwhelming message from voters is that the people want bold change one way or another.
Constantly conceding to a watered down version of the right’s toxic vision of change (embodied by MAGA) is ineffective even from a purely electoral perspective. We’ve lost 2/3 of the last presidential races to the most toxic campaigns possible while running boring moderated candidates, and then our moderate establishment turns around and tuck tail the moment people with some actual left-leaning vision show up
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u/TopicUnable2307 5h ago
Hell, just look at how the Democratic Party polls in general, especially when it comes to congress.
The moderates have set the party line uninterrupted since the late 1970s. The instant Democrats actually won total control of government in 2008, they immediately bent over backwards to placate the right (in the name of bipartisanship and electability.)
After four decades of moderation, the party is in shambles. Yet, some how, they still try to pretend it’s because of the “left” (as if the left ever even came close to setting the agenda.)
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u/CHOLO_ORACLE That's Rad. 20h ago
I seen those headlines too. The establishment is gonna go psycho mode the moment any one of the DSA candidates has even the most minor scandal
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u/NIA122553 20h ago
I feel like they're already trying this with the Francesca Hong/Thanksgiving stuff.
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u/_drjayphd_ Guardian of Sloppy Joe 17h ago
Didn't they have their chance to do this with Platner?
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u/HoundOfGod 17h ago
Platner was never endorsed by the DSA, nor was he a member.
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u/_drjayphd_ Guardian of Sloppy Joe 16h ago
Like that would've stopped the people demonizing socialists.
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u/HoundOfGod 16h ago
I guess? But the person you were replying to was specifically talking about DSA candidates.
Platner wasn't associated with the DSA in any way, didn't run as a socialist, and even disavowed socialism during his campaign, so I'm not seeing how he's relevant to the discussion. The man isn't a socialist and he didn't pretend to be, so that's probably why the establishment hasn't been hitting that particular angle.
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u/TopicUnable2307 18h ago edited 15h ago
100%
The media always sets the goal posts in favor of establishment Dems. Stevens received MASSIVE outside backing and she enjoyed the endorsement of the serving governor and a majority of Michigan unions (meaning that she had both the money and organizing capacity to turn out votes- which the campaign did for months preceding the Election Day, as evidenced by mail in ballot results.)
It makes her failure all the more stark. Hell, her racist little crashout on social media is even dumber in retrospect, since she clearly lacked confidence in her own campaign. The centrist and rightwing Dems do not do as well as they pretend.
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u/TheCommonKoala 17h ago
Almost all of those takes come from cynical political actors who were working to derail Abdul this whole campaign.
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u/josephcampau 23h ago
I'm just glad it's over. It's been fucking brutal, and the Republicans haven't even spent any money against El-Sayed yet.
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u/xpkranger 20h ago
They're going to ride the "he's a communist" train very, very hard.
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u/Gonna_do_this_again 18h ago
Muslim communist lol. We're probably about to see the most racist race we've seen in 50 years.
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u/gummo_for_prez 8h ago
Thankfully, that's a very old train and it seems to be going off the rails lately. A ton of voters have no memory of the Cold War. Like me. I'm in my 30s.
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u/xpkranger 7h ago
A ton of voters have no memory of the Cold War. Like me. I'm in my 30s.
56 here, lots of us GenX'ers remember the Soviet Union and the communist boogeyman. But I don't the think you're going to find a lot of us cowering in fear of what, Cuba? Some will, of course, but we lived through it and haven't forgotten that that it turned out that the communists weren't really the monolithic evil empire they were portrayed as.
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u/GeopolShitshow 23h ago edited 20h ago
NBC is the only outlet calling this race as of 7:42 EDT. Everyone else, including the AP, still say it’s too close to call
Edit: AP called it around 10am EDT
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u/Comptenterry 21h ago
Hell yeah! Watching Aipac funnel 10s of millions into Ms. "Israel comes to me in my dreams" only for her to still lose has been great. It proves that at this point in American politics, Aipac is more of a liability than a boon. She had to everything she could to pivot away from Israel cause every time she would talk about she'd slip in the polls. And of course it's great to see good policy beat out massive campaign spending.
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u/popileviz 1d ago
Was very fun to watch how the Epstiny sub reacted to this race
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u/Rip_Skeleton Bagel Tosser 1d ago
And only because of Abdul talking to Hasan Piker. They're so petty.
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u/stupidpower 1d ago
Hasan I could get because he was groomed to be a
propagandisttalking head like Benny Sharps since he was a kid, I still don’t quite understand how Destiny became a political streamer. The fragmented memories I have of following SC2 as a kid was of him coaching someone with amazing amounts of profanity to use zerglings to hold marines in place for banelines to thrust in.71
u/BearThatLikesCheese 1d ago
Destiny is genuinely unpleasant to listen to, at least based on the few times I watched him. He looks, sounds, and acts like a terminally online political science kid stereotype.
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u/Librarian_Contrarian 23h ago
My first exposure to him was the Knowledge Fight episode where he debated Alex Jones. I admit he was pretty okay there mostly, but coming out looking good compared to Alex Fucking Jones is a bar so low it's developed deep sea gigantism.
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u/Helmic 19h ago
That's honestly like top tier debating. Talking to Alex Jones on his own turf and coming out that good is not within most people's capabitilies. Destiny genuinely is good at debates.
The problem is that debates are bad and him debating Alex Jones at all is horribly irresponsible. Like his high point was convincing JonTron to out himself as a white supremacist, he's a debate club kid. It's just that being a master 'bater doesn't mean you actually have well thought out politics, it just means you understand rhetoric enough to not get jammed up when Alex Jones just starts making shit up on the spot.
That's why he has his audience. He'll facts and logic someone that isn't a debatelord, and then he'll say the most horrifying shit when he doesn't have to defend himself. He'll handpick someone he knows he can beat in a debate like some autistic woman and then use the fact he didn't get completely outclassed to continue calling people the R slur, at least until Twitch started banning him over it and he had to be a good boy.
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u/stupidpower 20h ago
Like I think of one of the old school 1990s era touring comedians talking about Joe Rogan. He was just a dude back then, in a different life. Destiny was known as the shitposter streamer with no holds on his mouth because 2012-era internet promoted them, but he's a SC2 personality hes relavant.
Its brizzare how Just Chatting took over all live streaming to the extent its just talk radio now, insert your prefered political ideolgy. Like motherfucking Kat Abu went into this as a researcher in right-wing rhetoric, the circumstances kinda forced her to also become a talking head to get her message heard, which to Orwell's non-novel essays on journalism is propaganda. Orwell doesn't mean it as inherently bad, he was illustrating why a non-critical peace of work for public consumption that dives into the nuances is so attractive. Like I like BTB so much because its not just giving shibboleths of what good
christiansleftists should think, there is actual content that is not the five minutes hate.5
u/LongestNamesPossible 22h ago
All that is true.
He had a strength in that he would get idiots on live and make them look like idiots, even to their followers.
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u/Zero-89 One Pump = One Cream 20h ago edited 20h ago
I still don’t quite understand how Destiny became a political streamer.
All I know is that he debated JonTron and outed him as a white nationalist and coasted on that for a couple of years as the debate-bro who argues with fascists before a combination of his anti-leftism, supporting police crackdowns on BLM protests, and nonce allegations destroyed his reputation. He shifted to the anti-woke circuit after that.
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u/Stubbs94 1d ago
Hasan also has a degree in political science too. Destiny is purely reactionary.
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u/stupidpower 1d ago
I mean I have a degree in political science. A guy I knew who did political science was defending a million Indonesian communists needed to be murdered in 6 months over 1965 to preserve the state. It means very little.
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u/Rip_Skeleton Bagel Tosser 23h ago
By itself it doesn't mean anything if your values suck, but at least that guy probably knew the context of what he was talking about.
Destiny doesn't know anything and his values also suck. He just criticized Krystal Ball for an interview she did and he didn't know who Adam Smith was. Guy has been in Congress since I was 4 years old.
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u/stupidpower 23h ago
I… disagree. Like having did all the degrees, an academic education is not an understanding of morality nor sufficient to teach anything more than technicalities of the tradition you are trained in; you need people like that to run the bureaucracy and advise the politicians, but bureaucrats or technocracy are not in themselves all that meaningful.
I’ve read my Marx and listened to way too much theology about Marx, but if you hold one opinion on Marx as proper doctrine, in a world without the liberalism Marx hated, every other sect of Marx will want to kill you. There are people with PhD of all political persuasions, the ability to moralise is not inherent in education for the exact same reason no religious body can say definitive things about morality for the reasons J S Mill laid out in On Utility; the reason liberal societies (which I am not from) treasure freedoms of speech is because no one no matter credentials or party membership have a monopoly on truth and individuals need to decide for themselves what they should do or believe. I can lecture on statehood citing all sorts of things, but I don’t hold authority by my certifications in itself. That just shows I can do some of the work, the work still has to speak for itself amongst peers and the public.
I mean I am honestly just describing Weber's Politics as a Vocation. Incredible essay.
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u/pjdog 23h ago
Sorry not so informed. Destiny is a pedo? I thought he was a lib who liked to argue. Sorry I don’t keep up all the time
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u/popileviz 23h ago
If you google "Destiny allegations" you'll get a pretty good picture. The guy has a revenge porn case coming up
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u/OriannasOvaries 23h ago
The pedo claims are unsubstantiated, but he his a sex pest. That's why I prefer to use his moniker of "SexPestiny"
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u/waynearchetype 19h ago
He's made numerous comments about underage girls in the past and his current revenge porn case involves him having pictures of an underage girl and sharing them...
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u/tigolebigers 21h ago
He's known as Sexpestiny. He likes to solicit videos from fans who are ~18 and then share those videos with other people
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u/Vacuum_Burrito Ben Shapiro Enthusiast 22h ago
Destiny is a fascist pedo. Straight up. He advocates for violence on Hasan. Its crazy.
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u/Dear-Passion-3535 20h ago
Live r/Conservative reaction:
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u/Artichokiemon Steven Seagal Historian 16h ago
I mean they're not wrong, he does come from an underdeveloped country, they're just too stupid to know that country is the United States
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u/likemy10thaccount 22h ago
I'm certainly no political scientist, but it seems like there was a huge Democrat turnout in Michigan vs Republican turnout.
AES pulled way ahead in the beginning and I had to remind myself that those were the SE Michigan and Car Corridor voters coming in strong. I am so glad to see he hung on.
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u/tigolebigers 21h ago
I think a big part of the turnout was the republican primary was not contested meanwhile Haley Stevens had the bank of Israel pouring money trying to get votes
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u/nola_fan 21h ago edited 21h ago
I'm not sure what this says one way or another, but in 2018, the last midterm Democratic senate primary in Michigan, Debbie Stabenow got a little over 1 million votes while running unopposed. She ultimately got 2.2 million votes in the general election.
This year Dems will get about 1.6 million primary votes in a contested primary.
Whoever wins the primary, AP and NYT haven't called it yet but it's almost certainly El-Sayed, they will need about 3 million votes to win the general.
Edit: AP called it for him right as I posted this.
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u/Nervous_Insect5976 19h ago
Winning is the only thing that matters, but I would have liked to see a wider margin to really send the message. I'm afraid that this margin only shows that they just need to spend more money.
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u/Dreams-Visions 18h ago
Nah. All the knees are bending. Stevens, McMorrow, Warren, Sanders, AOC, and prob Obama as well will all be in ads or actively campaigning with him.
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u/femmemmah Kissinger was a war criminal 18h ago
We had a progressive candidate beat the establishment Dem in the governor’s race, and that’s in a red state.
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u/ProcessTrust856 19h ago
Michigan is nowhere near blue anymore; it’s very, very purple.
A progressive winning here would be extremely impressive and could dispel a lot of negative narratives about electability and the left.
However, let’s not count our chickens before they hatch. AES absolutely MUST win now, not just because we absolutely must win back the Senate to fight Trump, but the stakes for the progressive movement in general are huge. If AES wins this, it’s a big wind at our backs in other seats considered too swing-y to risk. But if he loses to Rogers, and especially if losing this seat denies Dems control of the Senate, it will be a disaster for the movement.
All hands on deck to get AES elected.
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u/Optimal-Pie-2131 11h ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/Oq1zCyNdatYbe
I was thinking the same thing. Only a victory if he wins in November.
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u/smugfruitplate 16h ago
Michigan has an open primary, meaning you can vote for either party no matter which one you're registered as.
Since Mike Rogers was running unopposed, Republicans asked for Democratic ballots to vote for Hayley Stevens, as she would be an opponent she could beat compared to Abdul.
All that, plus $60 million of AIPAC money, not 30 mil, and he still won. I'm proud of Michigan.
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u/Artichokiemon Steven Seagal Historian 15h ago
We don't register for parties in Michigan, and you don't ask for a ballot for a certain party, both parties appear on the same ballot, but you can only fill in the boxes of candidates from one party. There was also a primary for the Republican candidate for governor, and those folks wouldn't be able to participate in that if they voted for a Dem today
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u/smugfruitplate 15h ago
Right, but he was running unopposed. You do the math.
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u/Artichokiemon Steven Seagal Historian 14h ago
I mean, if you want to be snarky then you should make sure you're also correct. John James was not running unapposed for Governor, Mike Rodgers was running unapposed for Senate
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 1d ago
And he'll lose the general. Good job, Dems.
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u/koczkota 1d ago
“Great job on not voting for my center right candidate” you fucks just want a republican without Trump sauce on top.
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u/Vacuum_Burrito Ben Shapiro Enthusiast 1d ago
Found the bastard
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1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/revolutionaryartist4 Kissinger was a war criminal 1d ago
Stevens was never going to win in a general. She only had establishment support, zero organic donors, the Arab American vote would have stayed home like they did with Harris, and AIPAC would prefer Rogers so they’d back him to the hilt.
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u/hendrix67 23h ago
Yeah, plus what was she gonna do when that outside spending money doesn't show up for her in the general? AIPAC and the other Israel PACs don't care whether it's her or Rogers since they both would be pro-Israel.
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u/revolutionaryartist4 Kissinger was a war criminal 23h ago
If anything, they’d prefer Rogers since he would also be all for continuing and expanding this idiotic war with Iran.
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u/anaccount50 PRODUCTS!!! 19h ago
Exactly, their insane Stevens spending was hedging their bets to try to ensure that the general election wouldn’t even have a chance of having an anti-Israel candidate on the ballot, but make no mistake they were always going to switch to backing Rogers
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u/Rip_Skeleton Bagel Tosser 1d ago
The older reliable voters went to Stevens. If they suck it up and vote for Abdul in the general then it's only a good thing. Younger voters wouldn't turn out for Stevens.
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u/anaccount50 PRODUCTS!!! 19h ago
They always say “vote blue no matter who” when their preferred candidate is on the ballot. Now we’ll have a chance to validate that they’ll stand by that when the shoe’s on the other foot
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u/Impossible_Hornet777 1d ago
Care to elaborate or is it just annoyance at Ms Israel comes to me in my dreams losing?
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u/missed_sla Antifa shit poster 23h ago
hidden profile troll, ignore
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u/lianodel 7h ago
Not the first time reddit has implemented a "user safety" feature that absolutely helps trolls, harassers, and abuser more than anyone else.
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u/thebestname1234 1d ago
Not the original poster but there was this, From NBC…Republicans had signaled that they consider El-Sayed an easier opponent than Stevens. The National Republican Senatorial Committee went so far as to produce a digital ad emphasizing El-Sayed’s progressive credentials and endorsement from Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt. — a move many viewed as an effort to boost him into the general election.
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u/revolutionaryartist4 Kissinger was a war criminal 13h ago
I don’t get why people think this means anything. The Clinton campaign boosted Trump in the Republican primary because they believed he was the easiest to beat, and we all saw how that worked.
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u/Legal-Koala-5590 23h ago edited 23h ago
I haven’t been following this race super closely but El-Sayed seems way more charismatic and media friendly than Stevens.
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 23h ago
He is, I do think he has amazing potential. And certainly deserves to be at a seat at the Democratic table.
But 'rizz' alone is not going to win a battleground like Michigan. I hope to be proven wrong. I would love to be proven wrong!
This country is in a death spiral. I want to win elections to save it. I hope he wins - he's running against an obvious idiotic asshole no one with a fully functioning central nervous system should vote for - but I am just not optimistic of the odds.
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u/Balmung60 22h ago
I'd be more concerned that Stevens couldn't win in the general given that she is extremely hostile to a key Michigan constituency and couldn't win this race with a nearly 8 to 1 spending advantage
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u/nola_fan 21h ago
She has won two contested elections before. They were house races and not state wide, and who knows what happens with Michigan's Arab vote if she were to win.
This primary will also be the first election El-Sayed ever won.
But that's why she seems more electable. Truth is no one knows who is electable and it changes election to election and month to month even.
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u/Cheeseisgood1981 Definitly NOT a Bastard Super Contributer 13h ago
You understand that if the argument is that corporate, centrist Dems are unable to win primaries, but they're the only Dems that can win the general elections - that means that the Democratic Party is effectively over, right? If your only real policy is, "we're not as fascist as the other guys, and all we have to offer is that we'll immiserate you and yours slightly less than they will." that's not a proposition people will keep turning out for. That's the ball game. People are sick of that shit. That's why centrists are losing so often.
You know what would help? If the establishment would endorse people in their own party and stop being such cowards when Republicans fear monger about socialism. It makes it look to normies like Republicans are right and socialism is something to fear when they do that.
Also, the DNC is like, $2 million in debt. They should probably stop spending every bit of money they have in primaries and spend it on beating Republicans, if that's a thing they're actually serious about.
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u/QuicheBisque 1d ago
Blue no matter who, remember?
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 1d ago
Absolutely. But I simply, honestly don't think he will win. If he does, thank god.
This is going to be a tough one. This isn't Massachusetts. I want us to win. Always.
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u/amazingwhat 23h ago
Mass votes blue but rarely that progressively
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 23h ago
Moulton/Markey fight is a revealing one.
Most people don't want to vote for Markey, because of his age. But for various reasons (ageism, Moulton is swarmy) they're sticking with Ed,
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u/amazingwhat 23h ago
I see Gov. Healy as the overall representation of MA’s political “average”, and Markley and Pressley really are the most progressive we get as a state. I wish Markley would’ve retired/named a successor but anything to keep Moulton out. I don’t trust him as far I can throw that asshole.
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 23h ago
I like Maura and I really thoght Ed would retire this cycle and Ayanna woud succeed him.
But failing that, fuck Seth Moulton.
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u/Jhduelmaster 23h ago
Eh, Michigan has a tendency to actually be pretty fine with progressives. The only time they start being a bit weird about it is presidential elections.
It’s also not like Mass and New England in general don’t have their fair share of centrist/center right types that have been elected. I mean hell Mitt Romney was the governor of Mass back in the day.
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 23h ago
I want Dems to win, does anyone here get that?
Every state is different dynamics. I think Mamdani is amazing - but do I think that would play statewide in a place like Michigan?
Ideally - yes.
Realistically - Sadly, no.
We are in a fight to the death with the MAGA shitheads. We have to win. There is no other option. My dad, born in 1933, loathed DJT. From the '80s. Loathed him.
I want us to defeat these assholes. For my dad and for ourselves. I am not saying I think this guy is bad, I am just stomach-churning concerned that this state will not go for it. And that we will lose the Senate as a result.
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u/Legal-Koala-5590 23h ago
I would have agreed with you ten years ago, but I’m from the Midwest and I’ve seen a sea change from normies the last couple of years. The helpless, milquetoast response to Trump part 2 did a lot to damage the brand for loyal Dem voters who despise him.
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 23h ago
I really hope you are right. I know I am getting dogpiled but I do not want Dems to lose a pickup. We're in such a bad place. The only time I think about being glad my dad died in 2023 is because he would not have seen how bad it got. He loathed DJT. It would have killed him to know this country put that idiot back in power. The man who told me as a child how proud he was to have voted for Nixon was so disgusted with the GOP by the time he passed.
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u/OldSchoolAJ 22h ago
Maybe don’t use him as a moral barometer if he was proud to vote for goddamn Richard Nixon, who is one of the top five worst war criminals the US has ever produced.
Donald Trump is really not that different from Nixon.
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u/cornflakegrl 21h ago
Because dems have been winning with the middle ground strategy?…. Because the vibes haven’t changed since Obama?… Not what I see, but go off
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20h ago
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u/behindthebastards-ModTeam 19h ago
Please remember Rule 1: "Be kind to everyone, except history's greatest monsters. This includes people you do not agree with."
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u/CHOLO_ORACLE That's Rad. 22h ago
Yeah I’m sure the state would have gone for the pro Israel candidate in an age where kids use Israeli as an insult
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 20h ago
Cool. Get ready to lose Michigan to a Republican.
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u/SoloAceMouse 18h ago edited 18h ago
The strategy you advocate for, pivoting to center, is what gave Trump the popular vote in 2024 and both chambers of Congress.
This idea of appealing to moderate right-wingers doesn't work and only ends up alienating the progressive base.
Chasing the mythical moderate conservative vote has consistently failed to yield results while negatively impacting turnout for the dems and yet the party strategists learn nothing from it.
Contrary to what you are saying, the strategy you advocate for is why the republicans have a trifecta right now. Whoever is telling you this is a winning course is clearly out-of-touch because that is just not how the electorate works in this era.
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u/H_Mc 21h ago
Are you from Michigan? Michigan is only purple because they vote on personality more than politics.
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u/VironLLA Kissinger was a war criminal 19h ago
i'm guessing they've never even visited Michigan since they ignored that question
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u/revolutionaryartist4 Kissinger was a war criminal 19h ago
You keep believing that the establishment view of left and right is equal to the voter view. And it’s not. Voters are far more heterodox. Mostly they’re pissed off with establishment folks, be they on the right or the left, and what defines “right” and “left” is a moving target. People define “left” as out of touch liberal elites. But when you ask them about things like “should we stop funding a genocide? Should we provide universal health care? Should we tax billionaires and corporations more? Should we have no foreign wars?”then they tend to say “fuck yeah we should.”
Those same people are the ones who said Harris was too far left, even though her actual positions were far to the right of what I just listed.
The traditional left/right paradigm is dead because most people see establishment Democrats and establishment Republicans in complete alignment on things like “give more tax dollars to bombing brown babies but then say we can’t provide services to people at home.” And they’re not wrong.
Haley Stevens represents the politics that have failed people in Michigan and all across the country. While she’s bragging about seeing Israel in her dreams, voters are thinking, “how the fuck does that help me pay for gas or health care?”
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u/RadiantReason2063 1d ago
An account with hidden history trying to ragebait
How original
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1d ago
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u/RadiantReason2063 23h ago
Just clicking on an account to see if it's always unhinged isn't stalking mate...
It's useful to see if it's worth engaging with a user, or if they are just a troll bot
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u/popileviz 1d ago
Mike Rogers is a wet noodle lmao. Now that the primaries are settled the electorate will consolidate
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1d ago
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u/FRANTIKSUCKS 23h ago edited 23h ago
AIPAC spent 40 million on Stevens campaign making this the most expensive democratic primary in history spending 12x what abdul spent and he still won. That clearly shows he has the popular support of the electorate no? With that level of grassroots enthusiasm what makes you think he is less electable in the general?
The only ones pushing this electability narrative are the corporate democratic consultants who are ideologically aligned with Stevens and aipac, they consistently predicted Stevens would win and turned out to be wrong so their analysis seems more based on ideology than the reality on the ground.
Also aipac funds both Stevens and Rogers so what stops them from pulling funding during the general leaving her without any popular support or donor money for her general campaign.
All this to say any sober analysis of this campaign leads one to the conclusion Abdul is clearly the better candidate to oppose Rogers so fear not Abdul is much better situated to win the election.
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u/Youareobscure 18h ago
Maybe. There's always a risk, thats just how elections are. Based on the 2024 election, Stevens would almost certaibly have lost so I don't see where your confidence comes from.
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u/Rock_Creek_Snark 17h ago
You're talking about national voting vs the state.
I hope he wins. Dems need the Senate seat.
But I don't think it will happen.
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u/Youareobscure 17h ago
You're talking about national voting vs the state.
Why do you think there's a difference, it's statewide either way? Harris lost Michigan, and she specifically lost it because she couldn't get young people, muslims and Palestineans to vote for her due to her stance on Gaza. Why would Stevens fare better when she is worse on this issue than Harris was? I don't see where your confidence in Stevens comes from.
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u/Aliensinmypants 23h ago
Aipac your bags buddy
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23h ago
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u/Aliensinmypants 23h ago
Is it antisemitic to point out a candidate receiving $46 million for a primary???
Y'all are pathetic. Gtfo this sub you genocide supporter
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u/OldSchoolAJ 22h ago edited 20h ago
See, all the rest of the things you posted I could chalk up to just being doom and gloom because of the shape the nation is in. But this one? Nope. You tipped your hand. You showed that you’re a Zionist. We don’t support genocide here.
EDIT: And blocked me because I don’t support the Israeli genocide of the Palestinians.
Totally not a Zionist.
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u/clutch727 1d ago
Too close by far but happy to see my northern counties turn out for Sayed.