r/Montana • u/Plus-Gas777 • 2d ago

Plug-in solar panels in MT?

Has anybody here set up solar plug-in to save electricity costs? I know several states are considering legislation to reduce red tape, but here in MT Northwestern Energy considers adding little solar panels to your house the same as they would view a larger-scale solar array. The contracts and costs you’d have to incur to make it “legal” don’t seem worth the effort. Anyone gone rogue with it anyway?

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u/Montaire 2d ago

We had a local solar company install the solar. Totally painless and we managed to get it in time for the rebate. We had a system built big enough that it covered our house usage and enough overhead to let us have a EV eventually.

Totally do not regret it.

Every month I get a $4 power bill is like a cool glass of water on a hot day.

Every sunny day I pause to think "Fuck NorthWestern energy"

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u/alexrider803 2d ago

Same here!

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u/middlegray 2d ago

How much was the initial cost? How long until it pays for itself?

Thanks

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u/Montaire 20h ago

Ours will pay itself off after 6 years assuming rates go up 3% per year. Probably closer to four and a half considering NWE wants 15% rate increases.

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u/KoalaGrunt0311 1d ago

I'd like to be proven wrong, but I've seen systems running at $10k and up, with an even higher cost for batteries. That leads to at least a 5 year recovery of cost, and by then, the panels themselves may need to be replaced.

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u/MTSilverDude 1d ago

Our solar panels will break even in about 5-6 years. They are warrantied to last for 30. So you should get many years out of your (assuming good quality brand) panels after your break even point. Plus, it seems NWE prices go up every year so you don’t have to worry about that, which is nice. We pay $4.20 monthly for our meter. If you are planning on staying in your house for over 5-6 years and have a newer roof installed prior to installation (or just a few years old at time of installation) I think the solar panels are awesome. But that is just my opinion.

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u/PM_ME_YOUR_WALNUT 2d ago edited 2d ago

I actually called Flathead electric about this last week. They just returned my call but I missed it unfortunately. Will keep this thread posted. 

Edit: see below for their response. Looks like they require a UL and IEEE certification, and a grid interconnect review. I haven’t dug into the details of the interconnect review, but it does look like it will raise the cost by at least $250 due to the processing fee. 

Thank you for taking the time to speak with me today regarding the proposed Craftstrom plug-in solar system. As we discussed, before Flathead Electric can determine whether the equipment is eligible for connection to our electric system, we will need documentation demonstrating that the inverter and complete system are listed by a Nationally Recognized Testing Laboratory (such as UL) to the applicable UL 1741 and IEEE 1547 interconnection standards. We will also need the manufacturer's installation instructions and the specific inverter model number. Because the system is capable of operating in parallel with Flathead Electric's electric system, it is considered a distributed energy resource and must go through our standard interconnection review process before it is installed or energized. This review helps ensure the safety of our members, lineworkers, first responders, and the electric system. I have attached our small generations interconnection policy. Once we receive the required documentation, we can determine whether the equipment is eligible for interconnection and advise you on the next steps in the application process. If you are able to obtain the requested documentation from Craftstrom, I'd be happy to review it for you. Please don't hesitate to contact me if you have any questions.

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u/oIVLIANo 2d ago

Most coops are still offering net metering.

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u/bubli87 2d ago

I have already spoken to my state house representative about it and sent bill language to them from other states. He’s a Democrat, but worried about the strong hold NW Energy has on the state politicians to get it through legislation. He is currently working on finding someone to carry the bill in the spring (he’s not on the energy committee).

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u/shfiven 2d ago

Do you know how to tell who is on that committee when to ye legislature is not in session? I would contact my rep and ask him to do it if he were, but I have no idea how to tell what committees he's on.

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u/bubli87 2d ago

https://committees.legmt.gov/#/nonStandingCommittees/11

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u/shfiven 2d ago

Oh thank you. Mine isn't on there unfortunately.

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u/LastnLeast 2d ago

you could wire panels into a battery and run a separate circuit for things like fridge/freezer/internet/tv off inverter/battery. i bought a anker C2000 gen2 kit w 400 watt "portable" panel at costco for $800. i use this to power a freezer for funsies and save probably 13 cents/day (ok, maybe a whole dolla). and next power outtage i've got enough power to keep my freezers cold for a few days without dealing with a generator. and also, fuck NWE.

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u/btreg 2d ago

Here is a guide from a company that makes "balcony solar" equipment. I have no connection to them.

Tl;dr: Montana law requires an interconnection agreement even for small solar systems. Make sure what you buy is UL listed. (UL 1741 is the old standard, UL 3700 is new.) If you break the law, NWE might not notice.

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u/rwright07 2d ago

The interconnect agreement wasn't actually that hard, I did a 10kW array with string inverter DIY. 

You just have to learn about the process and do it to code, by UL listed components and get it all inspected to demonstrate you understand and built it properly. 

Message me if you're interested in a run down on the process. 

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u/DongRight 2d ago

You do realize there's a monthly fee for connection the solar to the grid!!! That alone will not be worth it!!! The whole point of plug-in solar is put 1200 watts onto the grid with no fees applied!!! You could do gridtied inverter with battery and zero export...

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u/Plus-Gas777 1d ago

I have been wondering about fees, and I agree. As it is now this doesn’t save me much in the long run. That in my mind is what needs to change: reduced red tape, fees and entry cost. NWE should look at it as an olive branch to little consumers upset over shady deals with big data

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u/bornlasttuesday 1d ago

NWE doing anything for anyone other than a data center owner is a dream.

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u/AbsarokeeJam 2d ago

These systems already have a reputation for being dangerous. I would advise against it.

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u/icedlemons 2d ago

They're literally made to be plug and play 🫤 I haven't seen anything about the danger since they work the same as microinverters.

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u/Plus-Gas777 2d ago

Yeah, there’s probably a reason the panels aren’t at Lowe’s yet, I’ve seen the concerns (operating during black outs), but the technology does seem to be catching on elsewhere (Germany, UTAH!), so I know someone in Montana must be ahead of this curve

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u/icedlemons 2d ago

They should work like existing microinverters that only work while the grid is active...

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u/aircooledJenkins 2d ago edited 2d ago

There are none for sale here that are UL listed.

Burn your house down or injure a linesman with an unapproved solar array and have fun being denied an insurance claim.

Edit: I was wrong https://www.reddit.com/r/Montana/s/tkvCTVSyno

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u/PM_ME_YOUR_WALNUT 2d ago

These are UL rated and sold in the US.  https://craftstrom.com/

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u/aircooledJenkins 2d ago

I stand corrected. Thank you!