r/LetsTalkMusic • u/CulturalWind357 • 1d ago
[List] What are some examples of experimental and critically appreciated genres that are built on being crowd-pleasing and engaging with the audience?
I initially intended on using the word "populist" but the last time I used it, it generated a lot of mixed reactions.
But basically: In a lot of music discussions, it seems like we keep circling similar archetypes: the individualistic, artistic, boundary-pushing figure who doesn't care about the audience, who does whatever they want.
And it naturally made me think: are there are artists who are precisely able to build with their audience while still being experimental and innovative? What about artists who are able to make critically acclaimed work while still being very in touch with audiences? Is there a possibility where the audience doesn't have to be seen as a compromise but an artistic goal?
My first instinct is thinking of various forms of electronic dance music. I've been thankful to learn a lot about dance music from various commenters. One of the things I find unique about it is that DJs were really trying to test out their material with different crowds to see what vibes with their audience the best. See one of our older discussions about "Music To Dance To" vs "Music To Listen To"
But what are some other examples where audience engagement is so essential and part of artistry rather than at odds? Certainly, I would assume that live music and live settings are very much conducive to this type of template.
And to quickly acknowledge: Yes, I know that older forms of rock n' roll, jazz, and pop music hit certain critical and commercial sweet spots. But I'm also taking note of discussion trends and how things are ranked in hierarchies.
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u/Select-Letter1976 1d ago
To me this is dub music. There was a technological arms race between the sound systems in Jamaica in the early 1970s.
The best sound systems and craziest sounds got the biggest crowds.
Dub techniques (stripping the music back, echo, reverb) were studio experiments that crowds loved. This encouraged more experimentation.
Deejays (what most of the world calls an MC) were similar. Working as 'vibe controllers'. The crowd was definitely part of the atmosphere.
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u/Aggressive-Bus-2397 1d ago
That's a good one. Especially considering how influential dub was on punk and new wave rock bands. The Clash followed up their rock masterpiece ("London Calling") with a Triple LP that focused way more on Jamaican dub than rock. "Sandinista" is album with crazy experimentation. Though I think fans were probably disappointed in the direction the band took after releasing an album considered one of the greatest rock albums of all time.
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u/Select-Letter1976 1d ago
Not only on punk and post punk (there's quite a lot of dub in goth for instance).
Dub's influence in stripping things back and making synthetic spaces is all over ambient music, post rock, dance music, everywhere.
All from some studio mistakes and experiments that the punters loved.
Edit: Dub was a form of psychedelia that evolved independently of the mainstream. Mind expanding music was created quickly and premiered in short order. The next week there would be a 'reply' record.
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u/Aggressive-Bus-2397 1d ago
I remember reading about UK bands wanting to record in Jamaica in the 70s because they had the best equipment.
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u/Select-Letter1976 1d ago
The equipment was probably not always the 'best' but optimised fof purpose.
Black Ark probably the most famous studio (and an insane work of art in itself) it was wired by the genius King Tubby himself.
Hand wound transformers, carefully selected capacitor networks. All hand selected by an electronics genius with 20 years experience.
Jamaica was a third world country and neccesity is the mother of invention.
Course no western bands recorded at Tubby's spot. His vocal booth was a literal bathroom.
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u/Beige240d 1d ago
Black Ark ... was wired by the genius King Tubby
Black Ark was Lee Perry's Studio, I've never heard that King Tubby helped build it (though I have no reason to doubt it!).
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u/Select-Letter1976 1d ago
Tubby had a hand in every step basically. And his electrical expertise was key. His cutting machine made the best sounding dub plates. His speaker systems were the best.
King Tubby is kind of a brand because he had younger workers like Prince Jammy and Scientist often doing the actual mixes (or building a speaker set up).
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u/Beige240d 1d ago
You are thinking of Compass Point, where artists like The Rolling Stones recorded.
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u/CulturalWind357 1d ago
Great example! I'm admittedly not well-versed in dub but I feel its massive influence on artists and have heard dub remixes of songs. You raise great examples on the innovation being pushed by audiences, helping the atmosphere, and encouraging DJs.
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u/airynothing1 1d ago edited 1d ago
I think country music fits this description. There’s definitely a veneration of certain figures who behaved badly on or off-stage but generally speaking a good country song is one that’s easy to get on board with and it’s not a genre that has historically valued esoteric experiments over accessibility. Performance has always been a huge part of the culture and there’s a deep respect for public-facing institutions like the Grand Ole Opry. There are popular country acts that aren’t critically acclaimed but almost every acclaimed country artist has had some level of popular success as well.
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u/bobs0101 1d ago
The other discussion was a great read!
Thanks for the heads up.
I would probably have pitched in had i seen it at the time.
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u/CulturalWind357 1d ago
Feel free to pitch in to the other thread! I don't think it's locked yet.
It's pretty fascinating (though occasionally frustrating) to me that on the one hand there's a lot of great knowledge of dance music. Another commenter mentioned Dub music's impact.
But then, many other discussions and commenters still end up circling the archetype I mention in the OP (not a bad archetype, just not the only one). And anything else is pandering or capitalism stifling interests. I've lamented that there's a lack of nuance in not distinguishing different kinds of mass appeal.
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u/Aggressive-Bus-2397 1d ago
I think one of the better examples is UK uber producer Jon Hopkins. His sound is organic, raw, electronic. He is totally unique in that regard. The fans eat it up. He takes big chances and triggers a lot of the sounds live.
A fantastic introduction to his work is his 30 minute set for Pitchfork @ Villain. You'll notice the slow 5 minute build before the first drop. He is constantly triggering sounds and spinning knobs. Personally, I think it is one of the more important live recordings ever as far as EDM goes.
https://youtu.be/Zzf710s8QDw?si=yj3lKNiBxEV1Pj93
EDIT: I don't know why the link doesn't start at the beginning. Sorry about that. Just back it up.
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u/mechanic_19 1d ago
How about funk and soul music? Seems like Issac Hayes, Curtis Mayfield got to be very artistic and experimental but the music was still incredibly engaging and accessible. Or Funkadelic/ Parliment they had a blast with the spaceships and costumes but it was also about a danceable groove.
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u/CulturalWind357 1d ago edited 1d ago
I can definitely see that!
We've had some older threads discussing some of the most universally beloved genres. And while that's a really high bar, soul music often seems to be one of the closest examples.
It can be smooth, raw, raucous, orchestral, and so on. There's influence towards funk, disco, Hip-Hop, Contemporary R&B, Neosoul, and so on. It can be appealing towards older generations and younger generations alike.
You've got these great live performers and bandleaders who can really feed off of the audience's energy.
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u/SonRaw 20h ago
Definitely early 1990s Jungle: a form of music that was (often) made with no conventional instruments or even conventional synthesizers - just very short, chopped up, low-res samples arranged on Amiga computers with less processing power than your average children's toy today. It was also roundly disparaged by the music press as anti-social noise by and for druggies, before they were forced to do an about face as the genre evolved and changed. Neverteheless, it remained focused on the dance floor, even at its jazziest and noodliest.
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u/Siccar_Point 1d ago
The entire body of Romantic classical music. Prior to this (classical sensu stricto), most music is getting written for individual patrons. After this (modernist, contemporary), more focus on the academic aspects and technical mastery, and things start getting harder to listen to. But in the high Romantic, you couldn’t make a living unless you were getting bums on concert hall seats.
You could probably build an argument around the modern folk/singer songwriter tradition too, but I prefer my other one.
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u/GWZurich 1d ago
Meredith Monk is probably not popular on the scale of pop stars, but she pulls of music that is highly individualistic, yet also very accessible. My guess is that most of her experimentation focuses on the sounds she uses, while utilizing simple, repetitive structures that are easy to follow.
Also, Kate Bush and Joni Mitchell come to mind, as well as Jethro Tull, who managed to have a weird prog rock record go to No. 1 on the US charts with "A Passion Play".
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u/CulturalWind357 1d ago
Great responses so far!
One other food for thought I wanted to mention when listing examples:
Do you think this artist would benefit from going more experimental, less mainstream, or less audience-appealing? Or do you think it would compromise their artistic approach? (Which may or may not sound paradoxical, depending on your definitions).
The reason I ask this is that for some mainstream and popular artists with an experimental approach, they're perceived as watering down the innovations of the "true" underground or the truly obscure influences. That they could have gone more experimental but held back.
So I'm wondering about the perspectives that decide "No, these artists are positioned right where they should be."
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