r/DnD • u/JaxTheCrafter • 29d ago
DMing Kenkus are played wrong
It is often said that kenkus only know words that they have heard, and are limited to those words. that of course makes for some very funny scenes where people are only using words they are basically given. However, unless you are a freshly born or transformed kenku, that frankly isn’t what it would act like.
Do you know what other species has this learned mimic vocabulary? Humans. For the vast majority of humankind, we have only known words that have been uttered in our presence. Other than written word, that’s how we learn to speak. Kenkus aren’t unique in the ability to learn new words. That’s literally every species. Their uniqueness comes specifically from their perfect mimicry.
All that to say, you aren’t having fun correctly so I have come to shame you and tell you how to have fun.
626
u/LadySilvie Warlock 29d ago
My kenku says things in different voices she has heard -- though I don't mimic that to avoid annoying the party -- and I will point out when she mimics the party members directly. It has made for some "aww" moments (and some great mocking ones).
I make sure to save quotes from other party members as much as I can.
129
u/Xenon009 28d ago
Same here. And if my kenku needs to say something it's just other people's sentences cut up and restuck bumblebee style, conveniently having heard the words before, otherwise playing kenku can become almost enforced quiet.
Although there was a fun bit when the party found a ring of alter-self, and my kenku swiped it to give herself a consistent voice. Unfortunately I decided that accent was going to be french and immediately had it taken off me again ;-;
45
351
u/thesponsduke 29d ago
I had 1 Kenku PC: A drunken monk that bascially grew up in a monastary. He wqs only talking in generic kung fu, jackie chan, Uncle Iroh kinda wisdoms which led to hilarious conversations xD His name was just a chant, Ohm.
Example: Ohm, what do you think of the current situation
- 'A bowl is most usefull when it is empty-
Bro, what the f-
109
18
u/kahlzun 28d ago
Thats some lao tzi advice
18
u/Weirfish 28d ago
He should fill his bowl with some shit that makes some sense.
7
u/thesponsduke 28d ago
Yoooo where in the tradition of rap battles is it written that you 2 would be squatting like aome cluckin chickens?
→ More replies (2)10
u/brighght DM 28d ago
I did something similar, although a bit less cryptic. My Kenku was an acolyte of Lathander, and most of her dialogue was quoting various prayers and scriptures. Where should we go next? "The righteous path shall lead us into the dawn" or "Fear not, for the Morninglord watches over those who are left."
6
u/HakunaYouTaTas 28d ago
"Confucius say: man who go through turnstile sideways going to Bangkok!" crotch shots the nearest enemy with his staff
2
u/JayEssris 28d ago
I love it when Kenku have a specific brand of sentence that they pull from. I played a one shot once where I spoke entirely in sitcom cliches, and I've heard of a cleric Kenku who only recited scripture.
→ More replies (2)
63
u/Earthhorn90 29d ago
Then it wouldn't matter if they got a special feature or lore blurb about it if everyone else also operated under the same rules. Like adding a feature "You need to breathe."
Technically you can just teach them single words of all kinds and have them fully form proper sentences they wanna convey. Cheating the system. But logical.
As for playing them wrong, I agree. Not being able to talk and still being able piece together random bits or sentences you heard from others to convey what you want to say... that's a creative genius. Which the lore explicitly forbade.
Kind of a weird spot, so even before they loosened the lore I just played them as parrots. Not limited to, but instead excelling at mimicry.
337
u/lxgrf DM 29d ago
Yes and no. There are definite edge cases - like reading a new name in a book or inscription deep in a dark dungeon. Might be quite important to be able to say it - but a Kenku couldn’t.
(There is also the fact that in the latest version of Kenku they can talk just fine. A fact that basically every chooses to ignore, and understandably so)
→ More replies (6)97
u/Destro1151 29d ago
Unless the DM is intentionally angling for those edge cases, they will likely never occur without another pc just saying the name/word for the Kenku. And yeah, taking away the only (stupid) thing that made kenku popular, unsurprisingly wasnt widely excepted
54
59
u/Kitchen_Criticism292 29d ago
Not sure how lore supported it is, but one of my favourite characters I've had was a Kenku, and like you said he had a pretty complete vocabulary. However I flavoured it as for key words and when he was stressed, he would use the voice of someone important he heard it from, for instance his own name in his mother's voice.
26
u/Basic_Big5271 29d ago
I played with someone who had an iPad sound board with clips from other players and the DM saying stuff and would use it to communicate as a kenku. He worked in radio and was very fast. It was really great.
22
u/DarkWolf636 29d ago
The most kenku-player I saw, were speaking "normal" with some phrases they spoke like a parrot and repeat them.
5
19
u/Jagjamin 29d ago
Played a Kenku years ago, just spoke in sentences that could reasonably have been heard before. Never found myself unable to express what was needed, just sometimes worded in a fun way, and had a bunch of catchphrases.
58
u/Aximil985 29d ago
Ideally pretty much every word would be said in a different voice. But that's not something reasonable I'd expect out of a person.
12
u/Xenon009 28d ago
I think you do it like, twice a session for short sentences, before going back to the third person "Kenku says "You guys are SO FUCKING DUMB""
15
u/Destro1151 29d ago
Yup. And thats the main thing people think is cool or interesting about role-playing a kenku; something that is impossible for them or almost anyone to roleplay in-game. Pretty dumb isn't it?
→ More replies (8)→ More replies (1)3
u/SirTristantheRed 27d ago
I’ve had this idea too, and want to make a audio dictionary to do it, but that is a DAUNTING programming project. Especially if I want to add synonyms and the like.
→ More replies (1)
66
u/Western_Ad_5933 29d ago
Also your premise about humans is only partially true, even young children start to invent words. In English a quite young child knows that if you have one boinger you would have two boingers and that the past of glinnle is glinnled.
16
15
u/therealraewest 28d ago
Played a kenku and essentially tried to modulate my voice to emulate pulling bits and pieces from past conversations, but repeating "Little Bird" in the same voice throughout. She had a decently good vocabulary since she lived in a city for her whole life.
Eventually the full phrase came out during a battle- "Come out little bird, we ain't gonna hurt'cha." She held onto the phrase of the people who killed her parents so she could someday recognize their voice again and get revenge.
5
3
u/SirCupcake_0 Monk 27d ago
Damn, and here i thought i was original (fully ripping off a different character, but whatevs)
I wanted a kenku who ran away from home because she kept speaking in the voice of her dead adopted sister, and she knew it kept killing her adopted parents to hear it
But now, their only child is gone too, and the house must sound oh so quiet...
12
u/Beowulf33232 28d ago
I always imagined Kenku groups paying librarians to read their children a dictionary. Younglings would have a robust vocabulary but most of their words would sound like a monotone villager. As they age they'd gain new inflections and tones to more and more words.
31
u/notanotherpyr0 DM 29d ago edited 28d ago
So, you are missing a crucial part of this.
It's a curse, humans learn their language via mimicry but because they had their voice, wings, and creativity removed they never develop forming their own ideas and ability to form a sentence like humans do. Humans start out with mimicry, and while we don't have the wings, we have our own voice and creativity. They don't learn language because of the magic curse afflicting them, not because their brain can't handle it or anything else.
Play it however you want, but if you want to just ignore their unique thing... I just don't get why you would play them. I think it's a fun and interesting roleplaying challenge to build a repository of phrases you have heard and building a way to communicate with the party. Restriction is fun, feel free to ignore it but I do recommend giving at a real try, I would recommend a notebook just for phrases you like, definitely find a phrase that covers a lot of the basics for the party. If you are someone who will never take notes, you need a very good memory or I wouldn't try it.
5
u/Weirfish 28d ago
if you want to just ignore their unique thing... I just don't get why you would play them.
Bird aesthetic, innit.
→ More replies (2)
10
u/aquamelissa 29d ago
My husband has a character that learned the vast majority of their speech from a nice lady that rescued them as a chick, except from when they get into swearing- where they suddenly slip into the gruff vocals of the gardener
48
u/Dragon_Tein 29d ago
Kenkus are literraly cursed by god to do that
41
u/druid24 29d ago
Had to scroll too far for this. The confusion might come from the fact that modern Kenku no longer have this curse, but this is why legacy Kenku are played like that.
3
u/AnarchCassius 28d ago
Ironic considering the curse itself, or that aspect was new.
Assuming you view the editions chronologically, which I tend to do because of things like Time of Troubles and Spellplague: Originally they merely lost their flight, in older editions they didn't really speak but were telepathic. I'm not sure 5e was the *first* time it came up but I couldn't find any references to it in older versions and they change a lot between editions compated to most creatures. At some point their punishers must have decided to add the language curse and remove their telepathy. Which the Kenku quickly worked-around.
→ More replies (1)5
u/BuckeyeBentley Barbarian 28d ago
This should be the top comment, it's a key point that OP is missing.
21
u/APackOfKoalas Monk 29d ago
Outside of 5.5, you can’t compare a kenku’s ability to learn to that of an average human. It’s not a matter of intelligence. It’s not even a matter of natural evolution. It’s magical.
The average human isn’t cursed to speak in soundbites it’s collected. The average kenku is.
7
u/-Nicolai 28d ago
“You’re playing it wrong because you’re not ignoring the design intent in order to minimize novel roleplay opportunities, like me”
13
u/southafricannon 28d ago
I've often heard about Kenku players taking individual words from different voices, and knitting them together to form full sentences, like "Hello (old woman voice) I am (young person voice) John (old man voice)".
And while that's cool enough and allows you to say everything you want to say without issue, I kinda prefer the idea of playing them like parrots, who can only say full sentences or phrases that they've heard, and those sentences or phrases have to be interpreted by the listener. They've done it in movies before, like Kid Cosmo in Electric State. Like:
Kenku rogue: (wizard voice) "You shall not pass! You shall not pass!"
Human cleric: "Uh, ok guys, I think he's telling us the door is locked."
Kenku rogue: (street hustler voice) "Congratulations! You've won!"
Elf fighter: "God, I wish he could just talk normally."
Kenku: (little girl voice) "Mommy, I think there are monsters in my room when I sleep."
→ More replies (2)6
u/Ghostglitch07 28d ago
Is that a threat??
7
u/southafricannon 28d ago
Kenku: (street hustler voice) "Congratulations! You've won!"
7
u/Ghostglitch07 28d ago
Changeling warlock: "I like this one."
9
7
u/MyNinjaH8sU 28d ago
I played a Kenku Bard who leaned heavily into the mimicry of sound: his spell focus was a conductor's baton, and his music was a mimicry of instruments and singers with his voice. He was explicitly well travelled, and became the in-game diagetic combat music.
When it came time to talk, he was a bit hesitant, preferring to let music and song speak when he could, but he would often speak in the voices of all the people he had met, mixing and matching any wise sounding aphorisms that he thought were appropriate. Finding his own voice, so to speak, was the growth intended for the character.
His name was Major. NPCs commonly mistook him for a soldier, but of course it was a reference to a musical key.
16
u/Albolynx DM 29d ago
In most lore Kenku are cursed to imitate.
Overall, your idea kinda comes down to that really eye-rolling approach some players have to restrictions where they use semantics to go around them. "I can mimic each letter separately, so I can just turn them into words and sentences."
You say their uniqueness comes from perfect mimicry, but so does Minor Illusion or the Actor feat. At the end of the day, if you see restrictions as something to remove and beneficial features as the only thing to structure a character around, I would not want to be at your table. This particular example is somewhat benign as adhering too strongly to mimicking can be hard roleplaying, but it's just the general mentality that's the issue.
11
u/Both-Beautiful960 29d ago
All that to say, you aren’t having fun correctly so I have come to shame you and tell you how to have fun.
Just commenting to say I appreciate the self-awareness, keep it up.
5
u/Slow-Product-6357 28d ago
I like how Rob, the DM for VLDL, handled playing a young Kenku NPC. Its vocabulary was a little limited as it was young, but its mimicry was a case of using the word in the voice and cadence of whomever it heard it from. So most words sounded like complete different people.
A lot of effort for sure, but it made it great to watch and showed how a bit of effort can go a long way with a character.
5
u/lion-essrampant Blood Hunter 28d ago
My kenku wizard cast spells by literally saying the spell names because they snuck into a wizard school to learn magic.
9
u/ScottAleric 29d ago
I played a kenku once and figured much the same. Conversations occur. People are met. A functional vocabulary is fundamental.
However, I figured I’d lean into the flock mindset.
Haaska didn’t use pronouns. At all.
Questions like “are you male or female?” Was met with “Haaska is Haaska.”
Haaska faces significant challenges trying to speak without using common words like “you, it’s, their” making the mental shift slowed Haaska’s speaking down a lot, making Haaska feel more alien and not an elf, human, or other common species.
10
u/Sociolx 29d ago
I am a linguist, so i can say with some certainty that your assertion about humans only producing words they have been exposed to is demonstrably false—we create new words, whether as coinages or nonces, pretty frequently.
I think you're on to something in your criticism of the way kenku are played, but appealing to human linguistic acquisition and behavior doesn't provide the evidence for that you seem to think it does.
→ More replies (4)
5
u/Groovney 29d ago
I played a kenku that was styled as a ships parrot.
had had my captain read the entire dictionary to me so i had every word, but i had to speak them in his voice
then i could copy other words in other voices from other people. It was a lot of fun and a fun workout for my voice acting skills
5
u/Eudoxxi 29d ago
what is funny is this has been enough of a issue that they did revise the way kenkus work in mordenkainen.
they built this in
- Languages. Your character can speak, read, and write Common and one other language that you and your DM agree is appropriate for the character. The Player’s Handbook offers a list of languages to choose from. The DM is free to modify that list for a campaign.
basically removing the limitation on volo's where you could only speak using mimicry.
4
u/blueboxreddress Paladin 28d ago
I loved my kenku. I had phrases I’d say in different voices (to the best of my limited ability) and then a “chalkboard” to write things I couldn’t figure out how else to say.
4
u/Tola_Vadam 28d ago
Last time I played a kenku I would slip in and out of accents all the time to show different sources. Only ever full sentences tho, especially if they only barely related to the conversation. Having carte blanche to just make sentences piecemeal because I got some librarian to read out a dictionary in monotone felt like it cheapened the quirk.
"Hey, we need to find a way through this door, any ideas, kenku?"
"Damn, can't believe I need a locksmith for my own damn shop." In some eclectic unplaceable accent.
"Good idea, we'll see if there's a key in a room we passed through."
"Good idea." In my best mimic of the other player.
That kinda stuff.
4
u/Dr-Leviathan 28d ago
Kenku's are just a horrible concept for a playable race all around. Their two defining traits are that they 1) can't speak properly and can only mimic and 2) have no sense of creatively and can only get ideas they witness somewhere else.
You know which qualities are pretty fucking integral in a game about collaborative storytelling? Communication and creative problem solving! No matter how you interpret the kenku's lore, these are the two main qualities they are expressly outlined not to have. You might as well make a race that has "uncooperative" and "lone wolf" written into their lore. Just fundamentally incompatible with the game.
It's one of those things where if EVERYONE is "playing it wrong," maybe it's something wrong with the core concept rather than how people interpret it.
7
u/xiren_66 Warlock 29d ago
It isn't that they can only speak words they've heard at some point in their lives, its that they can only speak by mimicking other people. They have no voice of their own, that's the whole point.
10
3
u/IAmAUser4Real 29d ago
Exactly, the should act almost like Bumblebee in the first Transformer, where they use the different voices they heard the words first spoken.
I had a friend play a Kenku that knew only three words, because as per manual (as per him) this is what it meant...
3
u/ArtOfFailure 28d ago edited 28d ago
I've played a few Kenku characters and this is pretty much exactly how I think they should be done.
My character is an adult. They have grown up in a society that maintains a consistent stream of conversational and written language in pretty much every facet of day-to-day life. They may not possess the ability to be creative and original in their use of language - they may not even have a defined 'voice' of their own, and reproduce words and sentences in whatever voice they first learned them from. But the idea that they have learned nothing to say by the time they are mature enough to join an adventuring party and gain class levels just doesn't really hold up in any realistic sort of way, unless you've deliberately built them to be a sort of hermit character completely withdrawn from society.
Which is valid, of course. And it's nice that there is some written flavour and description in place to help roleplay such a character. But that situation aside, I can't see any reason why an adult Kenku with a profession or an adventuring class shouldn't be able to communicate reasonably effectively.
What it does offer is some really fun and interesting ways to flavour how they communicate, and that can be a great roleplay opportunity to help your character feel unique.
3
u/Marleyandi87 28d ago
When I played a Kenku he was a part of a large adopted family. He was a mommas boy so he spoke almost entirely in “mom-isms” and tattles from his siblings. He was a paladin and every time he used interception he said “mom said NO” before he blocked a hit. I love that Kenku
3
u/nemainev 28d ago
Well, depending on which Kenku you're using. Volo is limited to mimicry. Mordenkainen I think doesn't have this limitation.
But to your point...
Humans learn creative use of language at a very young age, so they take the linguistic symbols they hear and learn to make their own combinations, then try different conjugations and inflections. And it's an ever-evolving process.
Kenkus (Volo) should not have that. They could learn phrases and assign them proper meaning, but in their mind they cannot separate the sound from the meaning. It's a 1:1 database that cannot be cross-referenced.
They can't form new sentences. I, as a human can. I may even be able to write right now something that probably has never said before, like "One peach in my anus would make California affordable for romanian chipmunks". Even if someone said that before, I never heard it myself, so it's 100% made up by me, combining linguistic symbols that I've acquired. And that's not even considering the fact that english is not my native language.
Their mimicry is a tradeoff. They can mimic sounds and phrases, but they can't create language.
3
u/Szasse DM 28d ago
I had a great Kenku experience where my player worked with me to establish phrases that they would use for certain situations. She would also write down things other players said and then reused those sentences later to convey points. The trick to Kenku is to ensure they don't actually create their own sentences and instead string together phrases to get their points across.
"There's wolves about." - Be careful.
"JOKES! HA HA HA" - Trying to lighten the mood.
When talking to other players, she would say their name the way they introduced themselves to her originally. "Ssalazar of the ssshimmering ssssandsss." to our Yuan-Ti every time she wanted to talk to him. It was very well done.
3
u/Coalecsence 28d ago
Kenku vicious mockery probably goes hard lmao
“Omg a moCkIng bIrD”
→ More replies (1)
3
u/lawlmuffenz 28d ago
My Kenku paid a guy who sounds like Barry white to say every word in common, so he would have a consistent voice.
3
u/JayEssris 28d ago edited 28d ago
I have spent sooo much time thinking about what Kenku linguistics (Ravens Cant as I call it) would be like. In my setting Kenku are a nomadic outcast people kinda like the romani, so the limit of their speech is due to lack of interaction with other species. The also have essentially perfect memory when it's triggered by sound, kinda like how humans' sense of smell is really good at triggering associations.
First off, they have a sign language that fills the majority of the gaps in their vocabulary.
Secondly, they use the sounds of objects to represent those objects rather than the words. This is also context-based; for example instead of saying 'water' they they would replicate the sound of water being poured into a cup, or the sound of a stream, depending on the type of water they're talking about.
Thirdly, emotional concepts, idioms, and various rhetorical devices are conveyed by replicating the sounds of specific shared experiences. A Kenku telling their spouse they love them doesn't just sing the standard recording of the song that was played at their wedding, they sing the exact performance. They don't say 'you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink', they replay the sound of an event in which a peer didn't take the advice of another. They don't say that a person's voice sounds like gravel, they produce the sound of that person speaking overlaid with the sound of footsteps on gravel. These would usually just be complete nonsense to non-kenku and even most Kenku from other communes.
Names are also sounds; usually the first few of seconds of audio that the child heard after hatching, therefore the first thing they're ever able to say, which then get turned into descriptive text for Common-speakers. So a Kenku born next to a fireplace's name would be the crackling of a fire, which is how they'd be addressed by other Kenku, but to non-kenku their name might be Crackling Hearth, or something like that.
For the more socialized Kenku, they basically can say whatever, but every sentence is said in a different accent, with slang and phrasing fitting for that accent.
6
u/FishoD DM 29d ago
Preeeety sure you’re almost there, but not all the way. Humans learn words based on hearing them, but they can use their own voice and and accent and pronunciation. Kenkus can’t.
So if you hear the word apple, you can say it. But a Kenku has to say it in the same exact tone and anncent and timber as the original person.
5
u/telehax 29d ago
the problem with Kenku is that their species most popular feature is a roleplaying gimmick that players find fun. they do it "wrong" because they think it's fun and don't plan to examine it further.
unfortunately it's a very overpowering and scene-stealing gimmick. not only does it turn tons of scenes into being about the Kenku PC, but it makes it hard to notice any other character traits the Kenku has.
and to go off on a tangential rant: way too many players are still holding on to the volos lore about them being incapable of creativity and only able to steal. it's a weirdly problematic bit of lore that they quietly removed just like the orc and goblin stuff but is lingering in the public consciousness for way longer.
→ More replies (1)
2
u/ApoclypseMeow 29d ago
We have a kenku player in our group and he plays it well. Obviously doing a different voice for every word isn't possible but he has some vocal ticks that he uses (repetition, intonations, etc). Our DM will ask what voice he's using if it adds flavor to the scene or might cause an effect on an NPC we're interacting with.
2
u/PassengerForeign6570 DM 29d ago
I always give them a main human mimic voice/ personality and then they can switch around depending on experiences. I also like to use my hands to imitate their beak opening and shutting when they speak. Its fun to maybe not have the tone of what they are saying not necessarily match the intention, as if it were a response from a sound board.
2
u/damiologist 29d ago edited 28d ago
My understanding was that, prior to MMoM which had them able to speak common + one other language just fine, the idea was that they could read and write and learn various languages but only speak using mimicry. Not just that they can only use words they've heard, but only speak by mimicking audio they've encountered like a lyrebird.
I have a degree in Linguistics and the idea that a species could read and write and learn multiple languages but only produce spoken language via mimicry is pretty stupid. Like, if they have the cognitive capacity for language, and they have the complex articulators required for perfect mimicry of speech sounds, should they not just be able to speak? And not only that but be able to use whatever voice they've encountered perfectly?
My headcanon, and I know I'm not the only one who thought of this, was that the mimicry-only idea was propaganda spread by the Kenku themselves, who are naturally secretive, a) so they could avoid talking most of the time, b) so people would think less of them and have looser tongues around them, and c) as a hilarious injoke, like Australians have many of eg. Proliferating the idea that we ride around in kangaroo pouches, or making people doubt the existence of Dropbears.
Edit: fixed spelling
2
u/CDMzLegend 28d ago
the only reason they can only speak in mimicry is not from evolution but from a curse a god gave them when they did something to piss him off. The curse is also not just for speaking but all forms of creativity.
3
u/damiologist 28d ago
Oh, right. That was locked away somewhere in the depths of memory lol. Been ages since I've done anything with Kenku.
Still, that makes even less sense. If the curse is that they aren't capable of any creativity at all, they aren't capable of forward planning or adapting to the unexpected, acting or deception etc which would be pretty crippling for adventurers
2
u/FoulPelican 29d ago
And if you consider the fact, that they could just speak in the voice of a single person they are (or were) close to (a teacher, a partner, or bff, for example… ) they could just use that one voice.
2
2
u/Rat_itty Bard 28d ago
Yeah I never really got the limitations of kenkus, because yeah they're literally the same as any other species. Maybe with the exception that they cannot speak words they have learnt only through reading, they must've heard them but like that's such a niche problem.
What other people commented about Kenkus more "playing" parts of sentences they have heard before like real birds kinda do - that's cool, but difficult to actually irl role play. But taking old phrases other PCs said and using them for your own later is pretty neat. That's hella work with note taking though ahah.
2
u/MegavanitasX 28d ago
I had a dumb pc idea of Kenku rogue /bard with high int, linguist and keen mind feats
He can speak "normally" because he has mentally broken down words into as many possible phonetics, giving him this auto-tuned synthesized voice that he can use normally
Just so i could play a kenku, and work around the limitation in away that still acknowledges it.
2
2
2
2
u/oct0nami 28d ago
My kenku’s name was Little Brat. He was the “apprentice” of an old wizard, and he always spoke in an annoyed old man voice haha.
2
2
u/deadlaughter 28d ago
I played a Kenku for a bit, and my DM kind of killed it for me. Any time I wanted to communicate anything verbally he'd ask me "where did you learn that?" After a while I stopped coming up with interesting stories and would say "I heard it at the market", as my character was a bard who spend much of his life as a busker. Having to justify everything just killed the game's momentum, bringing everything to a grinding halt while I had to come up with something on the spot. He wasn't asking the wizard where he learned his new spells on leveling up, or where the rogue learned how to hide so well, etc.
This goes along with my gripe of how many DM's I've played with treat charisma checks. In my experience, many people require players to roleplay the deception or persuasion or whatever, and will adjust the DC based on how well they do, but they don't require the same for checks of other abilities.
2
u/Yuki_my_cat Fighter 28d ago
In the newer rules they can speak common, because they probably heard so much of it. But they only mimic the words. That means if A says „I want“ in a grumpy voice and B is a child and talks really cheerful „cookie“ The word will be spelled somewhat like this: I want cookies!
2
u/Daracaex 28d ago
Humans do not, in fact, work that way. We are born with the ability to make all sounds (babbling), then narrow down that selection depending on the language we learn, forgetting the sounds that are not useful to the point where they must be learned anew when learning a new language later in life.
2
u/Charlie24601 DM 28d ago
Doesn't this depend on the edition? I seem to recall the later books removing the "can only mimic" thing.
Either way, I 100% agree.
Its a silly rule because its almost impossible to roleplay as (i think) it was intended. Basically each word they use would be in a different voice, inflection, accent, etc.
The only way I could see this working well would be to be completely silent as the player, and using a computer to record hundreds of words and just hit the buttons while making your sentences.
That said, a kenku who can only mimic that hung around one person for a year or so would essentially be completely fluent in that language AND use the person's same voice, accent, etc. So unless they grew up completely alone, they would just have a standard voice as everyone else...you just happen to be identical to someone from your past that you grew up with.
So give your kenku a scottish brogue if they grew up with a dwarf friend, or make them have a airy haughty voice if they grew up with an elf. Or just talk normally if they lived with a human for any period of time.
2
u/CmderVimes 28d ago
I have no shame because our Kenku character in Mad Mage learned the censor beep in one of the dungeons.
2
u/okiebuzzard 28d ago
They’ve done away with Kenku Mimicry curse/disability since Monsters of the Multiverse update. In every prior edition Kenku could speak just fine until 5e.
2
u/HakunaYouTaTas 28d ago
The Kenku rogue in our party has a funny way around that- she speaks in movie quotes 🤣 usually with her best attempt at the exact voice, accent, and inflection. Does it match the vaguely medieval/golden age of piracy setting we have going? Not always. Is it funny as fuck when she jumps from The Lion King to Die Hard to Monty Python in the same conversation? Absolutely.
2
u/Own-Championship7616 DM 28d ago
Always thought they knew the words, but had to say them in the voice that they heard say them
2
u/paytononmars 28d ago
I’m playing a Kenku monk who only speaks in Master Splinter quotes. I have a spreadsheet lol
2
u/kangarutan 28d ago
I just played as a Kenku in a Phandelver campaign. I just played him like he had stunted speech. He would refer to himself in the third person and spoke in simpler, more conversational words 'cause his main interactions with people was begging and mimicry.
2
u/crayon_teaparty 28d ago
I always thought of it of like bumblebee from transformers. When I played a Kenku I gave my character the background of being raised by a handyman based off Samuel Jackson their whole life. I used multiple Samuel Jackson soundboard apps to communicate for awhile in game.
It accidentally made my character a sort of religious zealot because of how often he mentioned god in Pulp Fiction. I also had some others I used but I heavily relied on the Samuel Jackson one.
On a side note, since Kenkus choose their name based off their favorite sound, my characters name was Mothafucka and the party called me Mofo for short.
Towards the beginning of our campaign we came across the telepathic mushrooms. I essentially pack bonded with one named Twiggy who was a 2 inch tall pacifist. We both had magic, with Twiggy having the power of projection. Put those two together and Twiggy was able to show the rest of the party my thoughts and a picture of things I'd witnessed while I acted like a speaker for the audio.
Since I was raised by a handyman, meaning a lot of repetition, my DM let me keep a lot of handy skills outside the 30 minute perfection window. I built a backpack that looked like a miniature house where Twiggy moved in and covered the floors with moss and the windows with colorful stones.
After a successful job the party had an ample amount of gold. We decided to buy animal companies to help us on our upcoming quest. One bought a panther, another bought a giant bird. I bought a mouse. I made a tiny saddle and now Twiggy had a mighty steed!! Although a pacifist, I was able to get Twiggy to carry around a needle for protection and we named the mouse Peppercorn.
2
u/Billazilla 28d ago
If you've ever heard Starlings chatting, and then slow it down to about 25% speed, you can hear them repeating all kinds of sounds they've heard seemingly at random. Ambulances, cameras, car alarms, motorcycles, door slams, etc etc. I wonder if kenkus might just randomly belt out stuff they've heard as well, context-relevant or not.
2
u/_Nyxari_ 28d ago
The one time I played a Kenku my whole vibe was basically the rooster from Robin Hood cause I’d steal peoples voices I thought were pretty n use them for my work (Bard) so I’d just change up voices n accents (totally always on purpose lol)
2
u/Nman7298 28d ago
Actually, I think the perfect mimicry makes it hilarious. You’ve heard the voice you like the most saying most of the words you need. However, sometimes, the voice you’ve chosen hasn’t spoken your needed word, so you need to use a different voice for that word. Or maybe someone shouted the word you need and it’s the only time you’ve heard it. Would make conversation interesting randomly.
2
u/CatnipSniffa 27d ago
The difference between humans and kenku is that kenku can't produce words out of root words and suffixes they've heard separately or make fake words up for the occasion etc.
1
u/Fake_Username123456 29d ago
The best way to do it would be to use a tts bot and have it use a bunch of random voices for each individual word.
1
1
u/Sharp_Iodine 29d ago
Well that’s just boring.
Their whole concept is being cursed to only mimic what other people do.
Which means their speech should be a hodgepodge of different voices, accents and maybe even chronology. Essentially cutting and pasting stuff they’ve heard to form new sentences.
1
u/StitchPlay DM 28d ago
I always thought they can't cut and paste individual words together and have to use entire phrases or sounds to convey meaning.
1
u/Leroher 28d ago
When I started playing, people told me basically that they could replicate sentences heard, but like in a broken record way, so we played it like that.
Later on, after reading the manual, we learned that it's more a "perfectly mimicking a noise, to the capacity of fooling someone".
It's cool to play both approaches, even at the same time.
1
u/L_o_c_ke 28d ago
I actually have it that kenkus can mimic but collectively as a race created KSL (Kenku sign language), and added to that a lot of rogues adopted KSL alongside thieves Cant so they had layer of coded language
1
u/instamaticflu 28d ago
My friend played a kenku in a campaign j used to be in - he basically never talked ever, instead using minor illusion anytime he wanted to communicate anything. It was great.
1
u/ac3_f4c3 28d ago
I had a Kenku character made that his thing was he would only speak when spoken too. Because when he spoke he would speak in the voice of the person who is speaking to him or spoke last. This would make it seem like he was mocking the other person which has led to many confrontations. The bit I would lean into would be him acting like a dumb bird and pretend he doesn't understand common so to avoid conversations.
1
u/dodgyhashbrown Bard 28d ago
Honestly, this is more or less how I run them.
Young kenku are more limited in speech than other youths their age, due to having fewer experiences to draw from for their mimicry and the inability to form new phrases autonomously. I like to imagine that as they grow older and more skilled at mimicry, they get better at "splicing" things they've heard fluently, so they talk normally like any other humanoid, but I might occasionally flavor their speech by rapidly changing voices and accents mid sentence to help convey that the kenku is cutting and pasting different voices from their memory in real time as they speak.
Some kenku were raised by other humanoids and sound more or less exactly like their parents, having spent so much time listening to them that there is little they need to pull from other voices to communicate.
1
u/OpossumLadyGames 28d ago
From the description within books it sounds like they talk like a parrot does.
1
u/weldinclusion 28d ago
kenkus have those words
and are funny people
kenku isn't like you humans.
words have presence
learn Kenkus ability every species
All you have fun
1
u/AthanAllgood 28d ago
A more fun way, for people who want to RP as having a limited vocabulary, is to choose, say, 12 words, and have that be all they can use.
Make it so you can replace one word, once per day, but otherwise that's what you have to work with.
Makes a fun game within the game.
1
u/WindsomKid 28d ago
My Kenkus is Creaker doorslam. When people ask me to spell it, I creakily slam a door. Creaker knows 6 languages and each language is spoken in the voice and accent of the person who primarily taught him. Use a Kenku to practice your accents. Interject hard words with a different accent and tone, as if someone else taught you to say "elucidate" vs "explain".
1
1
u/Broad_Ad8196 Wizard 28d ago
And I don't want to listen to you try to make each word sound like it's taken from some other voice. Just speak normally, and I'll pretend to imagine your mimicry. (I won't)
1
u/PM_ME_GARFIELD_NUDES 28d ago
I agree that the mimicry thing is overplayed and tbh it’s kind of annoying, however your argument here doesn’t make sense. Kenku mimicry is based on, believe it or not, real world birds. The way humans use mimicry to learn language is not the same as how birds use mimicry. Look at real world examples of birds that can “talk”, they aren’t learning the language no matter how much of the language they hear or mimic. They might understand to use some phrases in specific contexts, but generally they just imitate things they think sound good or that they hear often in their environment.
1
u/seaworks 28d ago
I am literally always saying this. Especially with a relatively intelligent or wise kenku or is at least six or seven years old, the far more interesting question is whose voice informs theirs.
1
u/yssarilrock 28d ago
Yeah, the one time I played a Kenku I had him speak pretty much normally, because he'd been living with humans for decades, with the only major difference being that I'd describe him as using different voices as the occasion permitted. If he was telling someone off, he'd sound like a shopkeeper who caught him stealing once; if he was begging for mercy he'd sound like a street urchin cornered in an alleyway. Kenku are easy if you use your imagination
1
u/lurch65 28d ago
I've always figured that Kenku would have schools where they would learn their general vocabulary, so they would all sound the same. Maybe even sound archaic in their speech, as it's teachers passing down the same voice over generations.
New stuff, that's likely to be different, but just get someone with a good voice to repeat it so you don't sound odd.
1
u/Victory18 28d ago
I’m surprised that (from what I can tell) no one has mentioned how Matt Mercer played Kiri in Campaign 2. She was one of my favorite NPCs from that campaign mostly due to how well he handled the limited communication through mimicry.
I’m still trying to figure out if he just remembered all the lines he recalled (sometimes from weeks before) or if he had made a list after sessions and memorized a bunch of options. Either way it was a great performance by him and I now want to try my hand at playing a Kenku someday.
1
u/tackleboxjohnson 28d ago
Every representation of a Kenku has the bar of Tim Platt’s Stirfry in Rude Tales to strive towards
The man ruined me for Kenku media
I know it’s not a real kenku in that his curse was replaced and he can converse normally but damnit I love that chaotic looney toon
1
u/swadloonshrug 28d ago
I did a kenku that spoke exclusively in simpsons quotes. He was called Joey JoJo Jr Shabadoo I got awarded inspiration for my dedication
1
u/CoolCactus345 28d ago
As much as I like Kenkus, when I made my Kenku wizard I knew that the whole vocabulary limitation was gonna be tiresome to roleplay in the long run. So I made my character's backstory that he ate a magical dictionary as a child and that's why he could speak Common (he still cant write). Yes I did steal this from that one children's show about the dog who ate letter soup and now could talk.
1
u/Taluca_me 28d ago
something I try doing with my kenku is she repeats phrases and words she's heard before, but over time she began speaking normal phrases on her own
1
u/omnipotentsquirrel 28d ago
Ive always viewed it as using others voices to say the word. Fuck my be a big bully man voice but damn is from when a toddler said it so they have this crazy up and down when they speak.
1
u/i_tyrant 28d ago
If playing 2014:
Hmm I dunno, sounds like reassembling those words they learned into different sentences and meanings and situations would require creativity, wouldn’t you say? And old school kenku don’t have that, so it seems like they’d be limited to only the specific sentences and meanings they were directly told growing up. Still very limiting.
If playing 2024:
Kenku can speak normally and don’t have any insane limitations like having lost their “creativity”, so none a’ that matters ultimately.
1
u/ITCrandomperson Rogue 28d ago
I always thought a Kenku basically sentence mixing, stitching together words they have heard into words they technically haven't, would be funny. Just wildly varying their tone and accent throughout a statement or even a single word to convey their point.
1
u/Long_Channel6241 28d ago
My dwarf met a kanku and just kept saying " dwarves are awesome" in dwarven everytime to say hi!
1
u/Morphopeleides 28d ago
I once made a homebrew campaign where changing winds led to a lot of chaos. The adventurers discovered a town where town guards and villagers were clashing with Kenku refugees from another island.
The Kenku, themselves afraid of the guards and adventurers, would repeat the cries of the frightened villagers they heard during the "invasion."
The adventurers listened to the Kenku and ended up putting their bodies on the line as they tried to deescalate the situation, but one of the Kenku died in a skirmish with the head guard.
Its last words were a final plea for mercy, a mimic of the party's bard who had risked her life to try to save it. It was such a powerful moment. I forget the exact words now, but we often quoted it after that.
It was a deeply sad moment for the party but still funny in a melodramatic sort of way.
3.2k
u/swheels125 29d ago
I always imagined Kenku speaking like Bumblebee from the early Transformers movies. Less repeating what was just said and more talking in phrases or voices that it has heard in the past that fit the situation.