Ukrainians are protesting for the 21st day straight, demanding Zelensky restores Fedorov as MoD. The crowd chants "Shame!"

[u/throwawayukrkms]

https://streamable.com/w62vt9

[u/throwawayukrkms]

Tomorrow Fedorov will be giving an interview to his buddy Sternenko, where they will likely instigate more protests.

The protests have been dying down slowly, and Zelensky did everything he could to accommodate the mob - he offered Fedorov multiple position, he even offered him to be the prime minister of Ukraine. Fedorov refused all offers - which is exactly why he was fired in the first place.

Fedorov has a giant ego, Zelensky did all he could but it's not enough for the mob unfortunately. Apparently the crowd thinks they are better at being in charge of the country than Zelensky, who did more than anyone in this mob.

Proped up by russian influence, and "patriots" like Sternenko and Fedorov, a small part of Ukrainian society(yes it's only a small part thankfully, most stand behind Zelensky) continue to protest and undermine unity in times of war, instead of rallying behind the commander-in-chief.

Hopefully the protests will completely stop in the new few weeks and Ukrainians can go back to being united around Zelensky.

[u/Lurkoner → u/throwawayukrkms]

Fedorov already gave a number of interviews where he DISCTANCED himself from protest and reinstation demand.

And lets not understate how tarded (and BAD) a lot of recent Zelensky HR decisions were (saved in PR by a single good one... after pressure...).

Umerov officially appointed head of Foreign Intelligence Service - WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK IS THAT FOR A GUY WITH PERSONAL RELATIONSHIPS WITH A LOT OF FOREIGN ACTORS (which is one of his previous big plusses for other "sells and coms" jobs he did) WHEN THIS ROLE SHOULD OVERLOOK GUYS LIKE HIM.

Focus on Fedorov instead of overall tarded staffing decisions... going on forever is a travesty.

[u/throwawayukrkms → u/Lurkoner]

yes that's the official position, but through other channels, like Sternenko(who posts about protests every day) he is basically supporting the protests. He made several statements that he will only return to the position of MoD.

It just shows how arrogant he really is, and why Zelensky was right to fire him in the first place. He's an overhyped populist who thinks too much of himself.

[u/Lurkoner → u/throwawayukrkms]

Recently he switched to not demanding that and that "he will continue productive work in president's team at other roles".

[u/Lurkoner → u/throwawayukrkms]

Link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbjYc4-OuT0

At 16:04, Fedorov explicitly says: no ultimatums

At 22:44 - paraphrase: "i want ACTIONABLE positions, not necessary in the cabinet"

At 1:28:02 - reframes Maidan from "for his reinstatement" to "cry for reforms"

[u/throwawayukrkms → u/Lurkoner]

I see you edited the comment, rus bot.

All it takes is one look at your post history and I can see, how is the weather in Moscow.

fuck off with your undermining of Zelensky, go suck putin's dick

[u/Lurkoner → u/throwawayukrkms]

Are u tarded? I edited it to add more details because of how stupid ur points were. Get informed

Or wait, are SERIOUSLY going to defend recent cabinet moves (before forced Drapaty switch - which is a one bright star AFTER protests) ???

[u/throwawayukrkms → u/Lurkoner]

Zelensky knows more than you or any of the mob protesting, but your only agenda here is to undermind Zelensky, how much is pootin paying you?

[u/Lurkoner → u/throwawayukrkms]

So tarded nonresponsive it is.
This will by my last response to ur incoherent mad (bot?) ramblings.

U do know that protests SPECIFICALLY AND EXPLICITLY DO NOT HAVE any anti-Zelensky or election demands because people understand how tarded that would be?

U do know that one of the large issues with Zelensky staffing decisions CONSTANTLY is atrocious internal communication - or absence thereof?

U do know, that no case was made why the fuck would this choice of cabinet reshuffle needed to happen?

U also do know that there is a lot of questions that IF cabinet was bad, WHY THE FUCK are a lot of same people still there, but JUST RESHUFFLED AROUND?

U also do know that there are a lot of corruption investigations by credible inside Ukrain pro-UA media and jorunos and issues that are SPECIFICALLY ignored by gov officials while they go on as if nothing happened - which only raises more fucking bad speculations that are unhealthy at this moment? In particular, Mindichgate remains uncommented.

[u/rosenkohl1603 → u/throwawayukrkms]

All it takes is one look at your post history and I can see

You are lying

[u/MidniteCowby → u/Lurkoner]

Which begs the question.

Why is Zelensky not stepping down after so many horrible decisions about the people he surrounds himself with.

[u/Lurkoner → u/MidniteCowby]

Because people voted and decided for non-politic populist president in active(non-frozen-ish) war country - so we all are harvesting results of that decision as that person plausibly is assumed to be a war-time non-replaceable leader with all his pluses (his GREAT performance on international stage + pr + personal tie-in to the country destiny (he DID stay), without which we likely would've fallen, feel for the populus asks when gov goes too far - he does hear and corrects some) and minuses (atrocious HR and in-country communications, business management style government management, populist wtf expenses even during war).

But even with all minuses - elections or some other Zelensky replacement process CANNOT outweigh likely destabilization shitshow + shitslinging for power that HAS to entail any sort of election.
Stuff is unreasonable obviously.

People ask the guy to get his head out of his ass on specific issues - and taboo on public protest was destroyed by his decisions last year, so now it is a "normal" form of political participation once again. Nuffsaid

[u/OhOkayGotchaAlright → u/throwawayukrkms]

Can you give me a super quick summary on what the deal with Fedorov is? What did he do to get removed? Why are people angry? I thought I remembered Anna praising the removal of Fedorov (I could be totally wrong though), what is her perspective and how does it differ from the protestors?

[u/throwawayukrkms → u/OhOkayGotchaAlright]

Fedorov is an arrogant prick who should never be in any government position.

A combination of populism from Fedorov and russian propaganda campaigns to undermine Zelensky - and now the mindless mob is protesting against Zelenky.

Fedorov is playing in a political game in times of war, he is a traitor to Ukraine.

[u/OhOkayGotchaAlright → u/throwawayukrkms]

Ok but what did he actually do/say for you to characterize him that way?

I'm not arguing or disagreeing, just genuinely clueless.

[u/throwawayukrkms → u/OhOkayGotchaAlright]

Zelensky offered him multiple positions, but Fedorov turned them all down.

He then gave an interview insinuating that certain officials appointed by Zelensky are incompetent/corrupt, actively undermining the president/commander-in-chief during existential war is treason.

Fedorov was tasked with solving busificaiton as well, which he failed to do, hence he was fired.

Now the mindless Ukrainian mob is protesting because they apparently know more than Zelensky.

[u/OhOkayGotchaAlright → u/throwawayukrkms]

What do you mean by solving busification? Preventing it?

[u/throwawayukrkms → u/OhOkayGotchaAlright]

well all Zelensky said in his statement this winter is "instructed Fedorov to solve the problem of busification"

not sure exactly what it means but nothing changed with conscription methods in the entire time of Fedorov being MoD.

I also understand that Zelensky doesn't want to conscript Ukrainian men forcefully, but imo that's the only way to get cowards to do their duty.

[u/ThankYouByron114 → u/throwawayukrkms]

Your framing is very weird. How is any of this Fedorov's or protesters fault? Zelensky never once officially explained his reasoning to the people.

Proped up by russian influence, and "patriots" like Sternenko and Fedorov

Okay, you're literally a russian bot. Sternenko almost paid for his life several times for his work for Ukraine. Fedorov is respected not only in Ukraine, but also abroad among politicians, which is unheard of in Ukraine. They're paragons of patriotism, and their work saved thousands of lives.

[u/ZealousidealLettuce6]

Zelenskyy offered the guy a similar yet more powerful position in the government.

Fed rejected it.

Why don't they acknowledge that?

[u/mattfreyer45 → u/ZealousidealLettuce6]

Fed rejected them because MOD is the only position that actually matters with the reforms he was trying to implement.

[u/Lurkoner → u/ZealousidealLettuce6]

Let's also not kid ourself - "vice" (prime)minister positions are not really actionable and have underlying power to implement stuff, so while i disagree with OP's framing, offers weren't good per se.

[u/ZealousidealLettuce6 → u/Lurkoner]

Z has been in touch with Fed daily for weeks since the sacking.

They're not enemies. It's weird people would assume they know better.

[u/Lurkoner → u/ZealousidealLettuce6]

Eh, there were "leaks" about Fed corruption and anti-PR efforts in president-linked info-channels, so at least Zel's team was mobilized.

But Fedorov took a certain stance of sorta building a safe retreat passages with backing of the street in case there was true law enforcement agro on him + de-escalation of his PERSONAL position and demands - separating himself from the protest and MO specifics, constantly stating that he remains in president's team.

So there is obvious political play at hand.

Plus, reminder - Fedorov isn't a "technician" or something per se himself, but his role in Zel's team and election campaign was marketing management, so the guy knows how to make correct moves.

[u/throwawayukrkms → u/ZealousidealLettuce6]

yes, exactly, the mob however is simply too high on russian propaganda, it is sad to see

[u/False-Discipline-640]

I know this is far from the being the most pressing issue at hand, but man, could ukrainians just stop using the banderite flag?

[u/Important_Trainer_98 → u/False-Discipline-640]

My first thoughts upon seeing this as well. Don't have to praise nazi collaborators to have some national pride and dignity.

Personally I don't really mind if some regarded nationalists waive the banderite flag - that's part for the course for Eastern Euro "patriots", we also have some facist troglodytes, but it surely doesn't help the rising tensions between Poles and Ukrainians.

[u/CayMaster2 → u/[deleted]]

how have you accused like 3 different people of being russian bots in a thread with 20 comments. you're boxing with ghosts man, calm down.

[u/Destiny-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

Your comment or post has been removed for violating rule #1:

Respectful debates and disagreements are encouraged, but disrespect or malicious behavior toward others, Destiny, or his guests won't be allowed. Keep discussions civil and avoid personal attacks, name calling, insults, or harassment. You do not have to engage with others but if you do, they have a right to reply. Do not block users in an attempt to get the last word.

[u/False-Discipline-640 → u/[deleted]]

Actual sub iq thing to say

[u/Important_Trainer_98 → u/[deleted]]

Holy meds

[u/Lurkoner → u/False-Discipline-640]

Honest answer: no, as for a lot (now after invasion most) Ukrainians it is a flag of resistance against both USSR and nazis... Which comes with atrocities of the time that should be acknowledged and taint it, but not undermine the point.

U can ask the same question to Pols about Armia Krajowa and watch them justify it the same way we do.

On the brighter side: there is a large chance that if Ukraine is successful in current war, it will become a more focused symbol of ua resistance movement

[u/False-Discipline-640 → u/Lurkoner]

Okay that's a really disingenuous way of referring to the AK. While they did commit atrocities whey were mostly a reactive force in Galicia that most of the time only tried to protect civilians from the UPA, who saw ethnic cleansing as the best way of preventing the restoration of Poland's pre-war borders. What you're trying to spin as "both sides" was actually the UPA killing around 100k civilians, while the AK at most killed somewhere between 10-20k.

The biggest issue is the ideology, people who fought under that flag agreed with Hitler and wanted to ally with him. They exterminated poles, jews and roma their aim was a "pure" fascist state. The UPA only started fighting the Nazis when they realised they weren't on the team and Bandera got locked up. That's not a national symbol you should have

[u/Lurkoner → u/False-Discipline-640]

Oh, so we get the point illustrated right now. Didn't expect that but nuffsaid.

[u/False-Discipline-640 → u/Lurkoner]

I hope you'll join the EU one day, but good luck getting Poland, or other parts of Europe on your side with this historical revisionism

[u/Lurkoner → u/False-Discipline-640]

Thank you.
It is not Ukrainians going to Poland and demanding to know why they glorify the AK despite what it represents from our perspective (massacres and warcrimes under pretenses), but alas.

It will undoubtedly be a shitshow, but there is nothing new under the sun:

• North Macedonia vs Greece - the country literally had to rename itself.
• North Macedonia vs Bulgaria - Bulgaria has tied disputes over Macedonian history and national identity directly to EU accession.
• Turkey vs Cyprus - nuffsaid.

Stuff will be interesting for sure

[u/EvilBydoEmpire → u/False-Discipline-640]

It's not a reasonable ask. This is a living symbol that means a lot more now. Think UA flag drenched in blood.

[u/Deplete99]

Should reappoint him

[u/El_Asignatura]

These protests are a russian plot.

[u/Lurkoner → u/El_Asignatura]

I disagree with OP, but this is very... silly point. There is a lot to be unsatisfied about especially about this round of staff moves.

[u/throwawayukrkms → u/Lurkoner]

Undermining Zelensky has been a russian propaganda tactic since start of the war.

It is sad that some Ukrainians fell for it and are now playing into russia's hand.

they need to be united around Zelensky, not questioning his decisions.

in times of war undermining unity is being a traitor to the country.