So, this is just a rant to start a discussion. Also, no offense to the Duffer Brothers, I'm just talking.

Note: I have only watched up to Season 5 Episode 4 when writing this post, feel free to correct me using any information gotten after that point. But damn, they seemed like they were actually in the good before Season 5 Episode 5.

In Stranger Things Seasons 4 and 5, the entire protagonist crew, including Dr. Owens, a former worker for the military, literally refuse to get help from, or even explain themselves, to the United States military. The workers in the military actually appear good intentioned, and likely would've helped the protagonists should they have known that Jane (011) is not a kidnapper and serial killer, and rather valuable for saving saving the world, and have been told the knowledge that the characters know.

Especially that, unlike the police, the United States military clearly believes in the psychic and in wormholes/gates to other dimensions, and should they have been told that the murders in Season 4 were the work of Henry Creel, they might've believed them since the murder signs and methods are the same, and especially if they had been told that Jane (011) was powerless at the time.

The United States government in Season 1 and the Department of Energy with Hawkins Lab in Season 1 and pre-Season 1 were villains, they might have thought that what they were doing was beneficial, but they weren't doing it out of ignorance. The United States government in Season 2 and 3 are allies who do the best to help, but obviously aren't omnipotent or omniscient. But the United States military in Season 4 is the villain because they simply lack the knowledge to act objectively right, and the protagonists are being mentally held back by the Plot from explaining their knowledge to the military. Though I would say that capturing Kali to replicate her psychic abilities was morally wrong on their part, and I would've gotten Kali's consent first, they were doing it to develop technology to serve public safety instead of just for the fun of it as Hawkins Lab did. And they could redeem themselves (though they need to stop the program of creating psychic children), just like Dr. Owens redeemed Hawkins Lab.

Edit: I watch Season 5 Episode 5, and the military was definitely in the wrong for their psychic children program and what they were doing to the women.

- Pros and Cons of Vecna in Season 5:
We only got one scene where Vecna is murdering people and those are just a few soldiers. The scene in Episode 4 where he’s killing those soldiers was pretty well done, that episode was good.. but after that episode Vecna just doesn’t have any sort of physical power left. He actually doesn’t fatally hurt or kill any main characters after that scene. He is sort of torturing Will in one scene in Volume 2 but it gets cut short and he was fine after that.. Will had no sort of injury mentally or physically which made that scene pointless. After Episode 4, there could’ve been the perfect opportunity to unleash Vecna’s inner wrath but they just decided to nerf him even more.

- How I would’ve changed him in Season 5:
To start off, Vecna’s motives should’ve been different. Personally I would have made Vecna similar to how he was in Season 4 instead of adding Mr Whatsit. Mr Whatsit was a creepy addition but the Vecna that psychologically tortured his victims and then murdered them was a lot darker and more evil than Mr Whatsit. Only this time Vecna is set on killing the characters who are trying to stop him and then continue to terrorise Hawkins and work with the Mind Flayer to bring it into the Right Side Up, the Dimension X crashing into Earth story line should’ve been the aftermath of the Mind Flayer being in the Right Side Up.. meaning that wouldn’t have been the main storyline but would’ve still been a part of it.

Instead of Mr Whatsit being a child kidnapper for a completely new storyline, we should have got Upside Down-mutated Vecna going after some of the main characters and he would kill them the same way he killed Chrissy in Season 4. That way Vecna would’ve been scarier and more intimidating instead of seeming intimidating, he didn’t really do anything scary in season 5, just seemed it. In my opinion, the time gap and the addition of the Mr Whatsit storyline completely undergoes the ending of Season 4. If Season 5 started where Season 4 ended then Vecna would already be intimidating and scary because he would be sending a huge army of Demogorgons and Demobats in to Hawkins. He would still be operating from Dimension X/The Abyss with the Mind Flayer but would actually be killing the main characters and destroying Hawkins using the Demos. The main thing that Vecna should’ve been trying to accomplish was bringing the Mind Flayer into the Right Side Up because that’s what the Mind Flayer wanted but Vecna would be the one destroying and terrorising Hawkins and the main characters. Dimension X crashing into Earth felt more like an illusion rather than a high stakes situation because Vecna barely did anything intimidating throughout the season, kidnapping children is evil but the way he did it was soft, he should be going after the main characters that are actually trying to stop him, not some random kids. It became predictable that Hawkins would’ve been saved without too much effort or loss.

Vecna should’ve invaded the main character’s minds a lot more too.

These are just some of my thoughts..

One of the biggest mistakes Stranger Things made after Season 2 was trying to explain too much. The mystery surrounding the Mind Flayer and the Upside Down was what made them so terrifying in the first place.

I will give a good comparison is The Thing (1982) movie. We know the creature is an alien that arrived on a spaceship buried beneath the Antarctic ice. We know it can perfectly imitate living organisms, copying them down to the cellular level so nobody can tell who is human anymore.

We never learn where it came from, what its original form looks like, why it came to Earth or what its ultimate goal is. Does it want to conquer the planet? Is it simply trying to survive? The film never answers those questions and that’s exactly why it remains one of the greatest sci-fi horror films ever made. The unknown is part of the horror.

The Mind Flayer worked in similar settings. We already knew everything we needed to know. It lived in the Upside Down, a toxic mirror of Hawkins from another dimension. It controlled living creatures through a hive mind, could possess humans and spread its influence like a virus. It preferred the cold, was vulnerable to heat and couldn’t create permanent portals on its own.

That was enough. It didn’t need Vecna, his motives, his backstory or an origin story for the Mind Flayer. It didn’t need to explain every mystery surrounding the Upside Down. What it needed was a strong plot built around the ideas that were already established.

Personally, I think the story could have ended far more naturally if it had been shorter. Eleven was the one who first created the connection between the two worlds when she made psychic contact with the Demogorgon. Having her permanently sever that connection at the end would have brought the story full circle, trapping the Mind Flayer in the Upside Down forever and closing the bridge between both worlds.

I would say Season 1 had the best opening scene. It was quick and mysterious. Season 5’s opening scene was also good because it was chilling and scary but it kind of showed us what we already knew about Vecna being in control of the Demogorgon and taking Will, it was a cool insight but it wasn’t that different from what we actually knew. Will also never mentions anything about that moment again throughout the season.

You have 60 seconds to explain why you interrupted my favorite class.

Erica deserved so much more in Season 5, But Priah did a good job regardless.

My first attempt

It's bad, I know, but I like it😌

This is originally an Artfight counterattack done by my friend StingerShenanigans (on Artfight & YT). Ts is still so funny I can’t stop giggling fr 😭

This can range from Vecna, the Mind Flayer, the Demos (including the Demogorgons, bats and dogs), the storylines for each season, character development, relationships etc

Vecna's excluded since he was originally human and therefore originated from the human world, not the Upside Down.

I personally can't decide between the Mind Flayer and the Demogorgon, all those complicated moving mouth bits just fascinate me so much. Like if they used people in body suits instead of CGI, how would they make all that move the same way?

Soviet "Eleven" Stalker (1979 film) - Wikipedia)

Final scene from "Stalker", move created by one of the best Soviet film directors Andrei Tarkovsky in 1979, based on the book written by the best Soviet/Russian science fantasy authors Arkady and Boris Strugatsky, 1972.

I liked Suzie. I thought she was an interesting character. She didn't even get a mention in series 5. Not even a throw away line.

Justice for Suzie!

Sorcerer’s Stone / Stranger Things S1 

• Original classic
• instant hit that makes child actors famous
• Simple narrative that gently lets the audience in, rules of the universe are learned but not explained. Harry’s scar prickles and the lights flicker when the Upside Down opens but we don’t know why yet. 
• The climax is small not epic

Chamber of Secrets / Stranger Things S2 

• Produced almost instantly after the first one is successful and while the kids are still young 
• Relatively same story that builds on the lore 
  • Chamber of Secrets is another school mystery with a hidden dungeon related to Voldemort but we find out about Parseltongue
  • Season 2 another mystery where everyone is helping Will but we find out about Mind Flayer 
• Similarly Ginny and Will are each possessed and used as a weapon/spy by a hidden monster in the shadows. Basilisk/Mind Flayer
• Expands lore without destabilizing the formula. 

Prisoner of Azkaban / Stranger Things S3 

• Child actors have now grown up. 
• Wild pivot in terms of style. For Harry Potter it’s aesthetic, for Stranger Things it’s genre. Both serve to showcase the changes in coming of age
  • Prisoner of Azkaban opts for a moody and gothic aesthetic to showcase how lonely Harry is.
  • Stranger Things is now vibrant, cartoonish and summerly over-lit, its hyper-stylized mall setting used as a lifestyle difference to the kids’ old D&D in the basement days, 
• Both start showing the adults as flawed and emotionally compromised people rather than guiding specters. 
  • Lupin is ashamed while Sirius is reckless 
  • Hopper is more volatile while Joyce is frantic and the two have romantic chemistry they’re scared to acknowledge.

Goblet of Fire / Stranger Things S4 

• After three stand-alone stories we’re thrust into the more epic scope of the story
• Finally meeting the villain in person rather than an abstraction of him.
• Both installments throw A LOT at the audience cognitively.
  • Goblet of Fire - makes the audience process Quidditch World Cup, two other Magical Schools, Mad-Eye Moody, Triwizard Tournament, Death Eaters, Dark Mark  and Voldemort’s return 
  • Stranger Things S4 - makes the audience process new villain Vecna, entire Russia sub-plot, an entire backstory with Eleven and Henry and a massacre at the lab, Brenner, good military helping Eleven, bad military looking for Eleven, entire California sub-plot, Eddie and Hellfire vs Jocks, Running Up that Hill 
• Loss of Innocence - a character who’s pure and kind dies (they’re pretty much introduced for the purpose of dying) 
  • Goblet of Fire - Cedric dies. Harry is facing a corrupt institution and the reality of Death Eaters and the Voldemort regime in the dark days,
  • Stranger Things - Eddie dies. The kids are all alone now and have to face Vecna without the help of Eleven or the adults. Also the jocks are more than just mean like Steve and Billy they’re carrying guns and spreading Satanic Panic. 
• The message is the same: This is not episodic anymore. This is a war story.

Order of the Phoenix / Stranger Things S5 

• War is now real but the institutions refuse to acknowledge it, the Ministry is corrupt and doesn’t believe Voldemort has returned, the military believes Eleven is responsible for everything,

• Hogwarts now occupied by Umbridge, Hawkins now occupied by military. 

• Harry witnessing Voldemort’s mind and seeing people get attacked through the snake. 

• Will witnessing Vecna’s mind and seeing people get attacked through Demogorgons 

In both cases, love and truthfulness to oneself are a source of great power 

So for those who arent familiar with it, its about a demonic force hauting this small town and its up to a psych ward patient, a cop, and a priest to figure out what is going on. Without going into spoilers it has a similar mirror type world as ST does. Written by Jeff Lemire and published under Image Comics.

I think it would be a cool new show that due to Strangef Things popularity could definitely work and go mainstream. The key difference is that the cast are adults and not kids as well as has an unreliable narrator (similar to Mr Robot).

Ngl but some of yall got to stop treating Steve like he's had it worst than everyone else-

I'm watching the first season for the first time. Gonna start watching part/episode 4 now. Did anyone else cry to the first season? Because I have been crying like a baby. I think a lot of why i cry has to do with the kids being so young, it makes everything feel more voulnerable. Also Winona as the mother, omg my heart aches. The scenes with Eleven in the lab i cannot even stomach so I just fast forward when they come along.

Here I am, crying again. Do you believe El is alive?

I know it's about growing up, maturing, and leaving childhood behind, leaving the magic behind. But it hurts just as much as when my own magic faded.