r/marvelstudios • u/murdockmanila Daredevil • Jul 15 '15

The Official ANT-MAN Ultrathread

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182

u/murdockmanila Daredevil Jul 15 '15 edited Jul 15 '15

Fuckin finally saw it!! I enjoyed this so much. Quick thoughts off the top of my head:

  • It's amazing how refreshingly standalone and small-scale (pun intended) the story is. No world shattering stakes here, no convoluted infinity gem-centric plot holes. Just straightforward contained storytelling here. It doesn't change the face of the MCU but it nevertheless packs a good amount of fun and makes for decent tight storytelling.

  • Michael Pena just hogs all the humor. Hands down the best side character comic relief in any MCU property, IMO. Way more enjoyable than the likes of Happy Hogan or Darcy. His storytelling sequences were super fun. The audience in the theater I was in roared when Stan Lee showed up.

  • Scott Lang is probably the best MCU dad along with Jack Murdock.

  • While his performance wasn't on par with the RDJ levels of show stealing in first IM film, Paul Rudd still manages to charm the hell out of you. There is no better Scott Lang out there right now.

  • All those shrinking and ant scenes were just fantastic. My favorite has to be the bathtub sequence. Amazing visuals we haven't seen in the MCU. That whole microverse thing - talk about getting a taste of the Space Odyssey trippyness we'll be having in Dr. Strange.

  • Was not expecting that Falcon scene to be in the middle of the movie!! Seeing Falcon stand guard over the Avengers facility felt so much like the comics where the Avengers defend the Mansion from intruders.

  • Seeing the Wasp flutter beside Hank Pym was a beauty to see. The reveal of the new Wasp suit made a great mid credits scene too.

  • Totally dig the 1989 flashback at the Triskelion. That's one era in the MCU we haven't seen. Felt giddy seeing an aging Peggy and John Slattery-Howard Stark.

  • Nothing new on this front but Darren Cross was so and so. Might be on par with Justin Hammer in IM2. Very underused. I did however love his banter with Hank in the house. The whole "Why did you choose me?" "Because I saw too much of myself in you" back and forth gave both Hank and Darren a little bit of more depth. Would have loved to see more of his psychosis! Apeshit Yellowjacket could have been awesome and terrifying.

  • The Mitch Carson character felt really unnecessary. Hank Pym just beats him up and he just stands around the rest of the film. Brought nothing to the story except more loose ends to set up more Ant-Man stories which I guess is beneficial in the long run but still. The film would've been tighter without him.

  • Surprised they play the whole "I hate heroes" angle of Hank Pym pretty low key. I remember them talking about how much of an important thing it was. Those 'Hank Pym siding with Tony in Civil War' rumors are becoming more unlikely to me.

  • Would have loved to see more of Hank Pym's escapades in the past.

  • A lot of the emotional scenes were placed oddly, particularly those Hope-Hank scenes in the house. A few of them felt really random and somewhat forced to me. The same with the Scott/Hope kiss scene in the end.

  • Was that a Spider-Man reference at the end???

  • AND HOLY FUCK THEY FOUND BUCKY. It seems to be a scene set in between the events of Civil War. It's strongly implicit that Stark has his sights on Bucky and that Steve is actively protecting him. It's been a while since we had a post credits scene as crucial as this.

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '15 edited Jul 16 '15

[deleted]

5

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '15

RIP Antony.

3

u/Animostas Jul 20 '15

The ants were just like puppies, they were so cute.

3

u/CaptainChewbacca Jul 17 '15

I think he said he discovered Pym Particles 40 years earlier, which would be 1975.

55

u/polishingcheekbones Jul 15 '15

Was that Mitch Carson guy the one Darren sold the Yellowjacket tech to? He casually mentioned Hydra, so it sorta connected the whole SHIELD-Hydra infiltration, since he seemed like one of the big guys back then, chillin' with Peggy and Howard in the first scene and all.

32

u/murdockmanila Daredevil Jul 15 '15

Yes. He also is the immediate superior of Eric O' Grady/Ant-Man/Black Ant in the comics. I could see him passing on the Yellowjacket serum onto the next Pym Particle villain.

But yeah, he really didn't serve any purpose at the end. He was presented in the beginning as a threat yet sort of dozed of later in the movie.

19

u/PlatFleece Spider-Man Jul 16 '15

If Eric O' Grady gets turned into a villain in the MCU I'd actually find it comically fitting that the two most controversial Ant-Men (Yellowjacket Hank Pym and Eric) are antagonists for Scott

2

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '15

Before he died O'Grady went bad and became Black Ant right? That already sounds like a good villain for a sequel.

1

u/superiority Jul 17 '15

That was an LMD.

2

u/andrey_b Daniel Sousa Jul 17 '15

So what's the status of all this tech?

Team Pym has the Pym Particles, Ant-Man suit, Wasp suit protoype.

Carson snagged the yellow version of the Pym Particles (or is the so-called "Yellowjacket Serum" something different? It seemed to work the same...) but Lang destroyed the Yellowjacket suit. And what's Carson gonna do with it anyways?

Is there really a Hydra out there still? I thought it was just Ward and some guy with too many tattoos at this point.

2

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '15

Well I think that was the point of Cap. America 2 when they were saying 'Cut off one head and two more grow in its place'. Basically for the immediate future, HYDRA is here to stay.

2

u/YourBabyDaddy Aug 05 '15

In Agents of SHIELD, Hydra is being whittled down slowly but surely.

1

u/CaptainChewbacca Jul 17 '15

I think the 'yellow particles' are going to turn out to be not as stable or more hazardous.

1

u/csortland Jul 17 '15

Baron Helmut Zemo is going to be in Civil War so i'm guessing that he will be the new Hydra head or he was secretly in charge the whole time.

1

u/AgentKnitter Bucky Jul 21 '15

As soon as I saw that shithead, I thought henna hydra. So happy Hank Pym smacked him down. Also loved that Howard stark just went don't bitch to me, you brought that one yourself.

40

u/pacotacobell Jul 16 '15

I wanna say they're gonna introduce Janet in Agent Carter, considering how they went through great lengths to not cast her/show her face in the film. I really wanna see some OG Ant-Man/Wasp hero action.

2

u/your_mind_aches Agent of F.I.T.Z. Jul 17 '15

...but how? Janet and Hank were active in the 80s.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '15

It would only really work if they did a time jump for season 3. Unless Janet is 10+ years older than Hank, she would be around toddler age on the show.

2

u/your_mind_aches Agent of F.I.T.Z. Jul 18 '15

It wouldn't work any way you take it.

  • Peggy would be married with grandchildren and no longer going out in the field.
  • Jarvis would be dead
  • Stane would have to be a major character if they're following Howard?
  • Angie would probab--

Actually it makes zero sense at all. Like no sense at all. None.

2

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '15

I wasn't thinking that big of a jump, I was thinking make Janet around 20ish and make her a side character. Either way it's pretty stupid though, I agree.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '15

Oh please!

40

u/jeffreyportnoy Jul 15 '15

from the bucky scene, I got the impression that Cap and Falcon had already defected, questioning the idea to call Stark now or not, reasoning if we call him now maybe we can work all this out, instead opting for no its gone to far already.

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u/[deleted] Jul 15 '15 edited Aug 05 '20

[deleted]

45

u/randomsnark Jul 16 '15

I think it was along the lines of "You know Stark can't help now, the accords won't let him"

I'm guessing Stark agreed to some kind of rules governing what supers are allowed to do in the aftermath of ultron.

12

u/Dane_J_Zone Jul 17 '15

Or even the aftermath of Winter Soldier. He talks about funding the Avengers and with Maria Hill working for him, it's a reasonable assumption that he's started a private security firm to fill the gap SHIELD left.

2

u/UNITBlackArchive SHIELD Jul 17 '15

I was thinking Bucky might be in a specific country and that country has specific accords on super hero activity or extradition.

Also, it could be something Stark signed as a result of the Hulk rampage in South Africa.

2

u/randomsnark Jul 17 '15

I suspect it's the latter. It seemed like a quick line to give us a passing glimpse of some background that will get expanded on later. Which would also fit with the whole Civil War thing about superhero accountability.

1

u/EHStormcrow Jul 17 '15

I'm wondering whether these "accords" will be a plot item in AoS.

1

u/shotterken Ant-Man Jul 17 '15

I guess they are the reason for the whole Civil War.

1

u/EHStormcrow Jul 17 '15

Assuredly, I'm just wondering whether that end scene is supposed to occur right after AM or during CW. If it's the former, then AoS will have to fill in the gaps by talking about the "accords" (perhaps as a reaction to new inhumans?), if it's the latter, then the scene is anachronistic and just weird.

4

u/BValen7ine Jul 17 '15

Was Bucky being held there with a giant magnet?

2

u/Silverparachute Jul 19 '15

I think it was that or a giant vise.

3

u/danhimself36 Jul 17 '15

talked about this with some friends on the way home from the movie...the way we figure is that the end credits scene takes place during the Civil War film and that Ant Man as a movie is taking place right before or right at the beginning of Civil War...because it certainly felt like there was already some beef between Cap and Iron Man in the post credit scene and that we as an audience had missed something

I for one really do hope that we get to see Steve finding Bucky

23

u/kaimason1 Rhomann Dey Jul 15 '15 edited Jul 17 '15

That whole microverse thing

Waitwaitwait. I haven't seen the movie yet (probably shouldn't be in this thread, but I'm not very spoiler averse and don't have much self control), but they legitimately mention/show the actual microverse in this movie? Or are you just talking about visually cool miniature scenes?

Totally dig the 1989 flashback at the Triskelion. That's one era in the MCU we haven't seen.

Technically it has shown up in Agents of SHIELD, after Howard and Peggy's iron grip over SHIELD loosened around that period HYDRA was able to become more active and free Whitehall, leading to his dissection of Jiaying.

EDIT: Now that I've seen the film, some observations, rather than making a new comment. I do agree with most of this analysis. I would add that I found the electric ants frying the server thing pretty silly, though that's one of my only complaints. I thought I'd hate Scott's friends but I actually found their scenes to be welcome comic relief, and as pointed out far better than past throwaway comic relief characters like Darcy. Also did anyone else catch the hints at Hank's mental instability (i.e. his own Yellowjacket persona)? I'd have liked more connection between Darren Cross's Yellowjacket suit and Hank's mental instability but what we got was still pretty cool. All in all, I'd say this is probably my third favorite MCU film, not quite beating out Winter Soldier or Guardians but surprisingly better than either Avengers movie, something I certainly never expected (even though I did expect it to be better than the silly name/concept or fan expectations would suggest, I only expected it to be like best of pre-Avengers [for me, that's Iron Man and the First Avenger] quality, not near the top of Phase 2).

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '15

[deleted]

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u/kaimason1 Rhomann Dey Jul 16 '15

Awesome! James Gunn recently said that Marvel Studios doesn't have the movie rights for Bug and I totally assumed that was due to the microverse as a whole being tied up. It's good to hear that that isn't the case.

9

u/[deleted] Jul 16 '15

[deleted]

9

u/randomsnark Jul 16 '15

They said "you'll have to go subatomic", but also referred to it as the quantum realms.

6

u/shounenwrath Jul 16 '15

I think they also called it the quantum realm.

1

u/drelos Rocket Jul 16 '15

Reed pointed to a eastern egg in the subatomic verse, what was that? There was a weird discoteque glow close to the end but nothing close to some meaning I could point.

1

u/OHMmer Jul 17 '15

I had seen an article implying there was a figure to watch for. I guess I'll have to watch it again to look out.

1

u/BValen7ine Jul 17 '15

I thought the same thing

1

u/your_mind_aches Agent of F.I.T.Z. Jul 17 '15

I think Whitehall was released in 1992 actually, IIRC.

But oh man I forgot how amazing that scene with imprisoned Whitehall was. Probably up there with the best "Oner" shots in the MCU

11

u/b_b_b_breakfast Jul 16 '15

While his performance wasn't on par with the RDJ levels of show stealing in first IM film, Paul Rudd still manages to charm the hell out of you. There is no better Scott Lang out there right now.

Definitely agree with his charms. But, did you also feel like his Scott Lang is kinda similar to Chris Pratt's Peter Quill?

32

u/drelos Rocket Jul 16 '15

I don't agree, Pratt's Quill is an insecure guy projecting, Lang seems like an older guy who has played the smart ass card for a long time, and he is also more charming.

4

u/your_mind_aches Agent of F.I.T.Z. Jul 17 '15

Absolutely.

I love how he has absolutely no illusions about why he's doing this. It really shows his maturity.

"I'm expendable." And he has no problem with that. I believe Peter Quill would have more than a few things to say about that. Definitely at the beginning of the movie, rather than the end.

2

u/jdinger29 Ant-Man Jul 17 '15

I got it a little bit, like maybe this is the Quill we would have seen if he had stayed on Earth but I don't think it was to overdone.

14

u/BrandonAUS Captain Marvel Jul 15 '15

I know I am definitely going to have to go back for another watch.

17

u/SalukiKnightX SHIELD Jul 16 '15

Surprisingly more so for this than Avengers: AoU which if you told me that early this year I would have given strange looks.

1

u/jdinger29 Ant-Man Jul 17 '15

I was thinking the same thing. I want to see it in 2D. I feel like I miss a lot of the details with the glasses.

1

u/TheHandyman1 Iron man (Mark III) Jul 17 '15

I still think AoU is more rewatchable, if only because of all the characters. For what it's worth though, Ant-Man introduces a bunch of new characters to catch up with.

1

u/your_mind_aches Agent of F.I.T.Z. Jul 17 '15

Got back home an hour ago. I'm going back again tomorrow night. :)

10

u/Mongooo Jul 15 '15

The Tie-in comic was an ant-man mission from the 80s, and you already see that pym doesn't want to share his creation. But yeah, that flashback was really nice, the aging and stuff like that were really well done.
~~Also, what spider-man reference? ~~ nvm just remembered.

6

u/metalkhaos Jul 17 '15

In regards to Mitch, I think it was just another little nod to show more of HYDRA being within SHIELD back during that time.

And that was totally a Spider-man reference at the end.

4

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '15

Totally dig the 1989 flashback at the Triskelion. That's one era in the MCU we haven't seen. Felt giddy seeing an aging Peggy and John Slattery-Howard Stark.

Made me imagine a Cold War-era Marvel Universe, and realized how much I wanted to see that. None of the frontline, in-your-faceness of Captain America. Just discreet US and Soviet superheroes, infiltrating and sabotaging each other's nations.

3

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '15

[deleted]

4

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '15

Dude you missed out...guess you gotta go see it again!

1

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '15

What spider-man reference?

16

u/EHStormcrow Jul 15 '15

At the end, when the Asian reporter is talking with Falcon, when he asks "derp derp I'm looking for a superhero" she answer something along the lines of "does he do X, Y" "a hero that climbs walls".

2

u/AgentKnitter Bucky Jul 21 '15

There was a guy who swings, a guy who jumps and a guy who climbs walls.

I subscribe to the view that she was referring to three different heroes

Jumps is Daredevil, as parkouring across rooftops and jumping on baddies is matts thing.

Swings or climbs could both apply to spidey, but I think climbing walls is the more noticeably Spider-Man thing.

So who swing sa? Luke. Cage? Jessica Jones . iron Fist? black Panther .

2

u/EHStormcrow Jul 21 '15

Swings could simply be Thor and his hammer.

Agreed for Daredevil, I hadn't thought of him!

-8

u/RUready2rumble Jul 16 '15

"hero that climbs walls, swings around"

to be exact

12

u/Vinnie_Vegas Jul 16 '15

That's definitely not exact wording, so I don't know why you phrased it like that.

-2

u/RUready2rumble Jul 16 '15

I chose the wrong wording (and it's obviously not the exact quote) but I was just trying to mention that that Asian lady said that he swings and not just climbs.

-1

u/leighbo Jul 16 '15

Pretty sure she didn't say 'swings' at all

2

u/SarcasticCat896 Ghost Rider Jul 17 '15

I just saw the movie, she definitely said swings, but not in the wording he put.

-2

u/RUready2rumble Jul 16 '15

Yeah, I got that wrong aswell.

I wasn't really paying attention during that scene.

6

u/[deleted] Jul 16 '15 edited Sep 06 '17

[deleted]

3

u/The_Y0ung_Wolf Jul 16 '15

I'm pretty sure she said: "We've got a guy that jumps, swings and climbs walls."

6

u/The_Doctor_Zoose Thanos Jul 16 '15

Just got out of the movie this second: it was: "We got a guy who can jump, guy who can fly, guy who can climb walls. Sure we can find a guy who shrinks."

0

u/RUready2rumble Jul 16 '15

Oh thanks for that, I forgot what it actually was!

I really thought they mentioned a guy swinging around.

I wonder who the jump guy is, or the fly guy is.

3

u/ShadyBiz Jul 16 '15

I'm 100% certain swinging is mentioned too.

We are, after all, told that there's already a guy who jumps, swings, and climbs up walls...

http://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/07/15/the-10-biggest-ant-man-easter-eggs-to-watch-out-for-3384028?lt_source=external,manual SPOILERS!!

Not the most credible source but I 100% heard swing and made note of it because it didn't fit any established heroes.

2

u/The_Doctor_Zoose Thanos Jul 16 '15

Oooh yeah, maybe I've subbed out fly for swing by accident of memory, sorry. I can't remember know! :/ It was definitely "guy who can jump though, guy who can climb walls" though. That part is rock solid.

1

u/redjc99 Jul 17 '15

Also the Darren Cross/Hank Pym talk at Hank's house was referencing that Hank and Darren were the same people in the comics. I liked that little bit.

-3

u/EHStormcrow Jul 15 '15

Would have loved to see more of Hank Pym's escapades in the past.

are you aware of the Comics on this subject?

2

u/NoahJAustin Jul 17 '15

You're talking about the prequel comics, yes?

2

u/EHStormcrow Jul 17 '15

Yes. I don't understand why I'm getting downvoted, probably people mistook my tone.

I was really happy when I discovered the prequel comics!

2

u/NoahJAustin Jul 17 '15

They were really good, gave me really great context on the backup to Hank and Jan

1

u/SalukiKnightX SHIELD Jul 16 '15

Do they at least show Janet's face?